Badtimes

[BruceTS]

Look what I happen to see on the highway..........

http://bruce.calrockx.com/4runner/misc/badtimes.jpg

[Seanz0rz]

whos truck is that? looks very familiar...

oh, my, god... what happened?

i see hes on the internet now, so im assuming hes ok. everyone else olright? howd that happen? does this mean i cant go offloading with you this summer?

[Seanz0rz]

you guys cant just leave me hanging like this, i will get NO sleep if you do this to me...

[GrnGrand97]

O man I hope that isn't Lance! Definitely looks like his rig though.

[Elton]

that sucks need more info and pics

[mastacox]

Looks like Lance ran into something :( Hope he gets it fixed quick, he's almost the only 4th gen guy on here...

Maybe a moose?
http://www.mass.gov/dfwele/dfw/dfwimg/dfw_bull_moose.jpg

[Marc P]

Crap!! That sucks Lance!! I hope you are ok...we can rebuild it, we have the technology.

[slosurfer]

Lance! :( That sucks, I hope everyone is okay though. I am going to be thinking about this all day at work now. I hope you guys are fine.

[bamachem]

everybody was fine except for lance's ego. :tongueout: i'll let him post the details.

[ecchamberlin]

Oh man! Not good.

There has to be a story behind that!

[tacoclimber]

That's such a bummer! I hope the damage isn't as extensive as it looks.

Lance, you gotta fill us in here, man, we're all bummed for you!

[randver]

good to hear everyones ok. cant wait to here the story too.

[garrett]

oh man... it was so pretty too! glad you're okay!

[Good Times]

holy crap what the heck happened!?!?!










doh! yeah it's me :( the parties involved in the accident walked away fine so we're all glad we didn't have any injuries at all. the other truck has some scratches on their tubed race truck (they're built like a rock!). The impact was something else though as it was definitely a hard impact (well that's how it felt). My truck looks like crap right now as it really ate the rear tube bumper of the race truck. ugh.

Miscommunication and driver error was the root of the issue (never once did anyone point fingers so the guys I was rolling with are a class act!). Things like this can happen on any trip and I'm glad Team Locos Mocos and the Total Chaos crew were there to help me. Long story short, after the accident it took 9 hours and over 100 miles of dirt to get the 4runner back on the pavement. The LM guys got me an uhaul and trailer while the new Toyota Tundra got me towed over the 100 miles. I gotta say the new Tundy ROCKS! It's a monster tow vehicle :)

I'm going to be taking the truck apart and make a determination as to what to do next.

Definitely an ego buster... doh!

Detailed story to come in the event report section.

Thanks :)

Edit: frame walked away with no damages!! (surprisingly) but all of that sheet metal up on top is done. Engine looks to be ok but the there's a lot that needs repairing.

[d0ubledown]

ouch man...thats gotta hurt. glad the only damage was your ego...pretty 4th gen winched & tube bumpered front ends can easily be re & re'd...

hopefully you'll come out with something new and improved on the rebuild. 'better times' maybe?..hahah

[paddlenbike]

Lance, glad to hear everyone is okay. It hasn't been rolled and the frame is straight, certainly you'll be money ahead to do the repair work rather than risk an insurance claim (to which you might not get paid due to the incident occuring offroad.)

Let me know if there is anything I can do to help.
Ken

[Ric]

as others have said, Im glad "your" ok, the vehicle can be replaced.
from my understanding, atleast from my Ins. agent, it will be covered... dont matter if it happened off-road or not, as long you wasnt racing in a event. atleast thats what my Ins. agent told me, and all the aftermarket suff would be replaced, as long as i provide a receipt.

but, just glad you all are ok, thats all that really matters :thumbup:

[BruceTS]

http://bruce.calrockx.com/4runner/misc/lance.jpg

[Seanz0rz]

wow, in the same breath, its bad, and its not that bad...

totally fixable.

[reggie 00]

Glad every ones OK.

It does look like it might just Buff out.
It is a Toyota after all.

[expatoz]

Hey Lance.

Shiiiiit happens. Glad everyone is ok. Hope this didn't inflame your existing ankle (?) problem.

If you need help with anything, give me a call. I'll pick up parts...whatever.

Cheers
Mark

[ecchamberlin]

Lance
Crazy dayz man. I know this is probably a stupid question but did your air bag go off. There has always been so much talk about if custom bumpers would effect this or not so I was just wondering.

BTW I have no doubt that your rig will be bigger and badder than it was! before.

[Tanto]

Holy crap, Lance. Was that during the Total Chaos run you talked to me about?

I'm looking forward to seeing another buildup of yours. And there are much more embarassing ways to damage your vehicle ;)

[PhorunninDuke]

I think it looks better already. Kind of like a bed bob to the front. Looks tough. I say work with it.

[Cheese]

How did this happen?

Why were you tailgating at speed in limited visibility?

[Good Times]

eric, airbags did not go off. not sure why it didn't go off as just before impact i was preparing myself for it. definitely surprised that it did not. i suspect that the deceleration figures upon impact were vastly different causing the airbags to not deploy. Not sure if this is directly related to the tube bumper itself or what not but i can assure you it did not deploy. impact speed was definitely more than 5mph (and we're talking magnitude here). draw your own conclusions as i thought it was going to deploy but it didn't. good and bad i guess. dunno...

ryan, yup this was the very trip i was telling you about. when you're back we'll get ya strapped in one of these events :) (of course w/o the accident(s) though!)

chaos edition - it'll get repaired one way or another. not sure how that'll happen but it will be better and stronger :)

this incident was simply an accident. i would love to blame everyone but myself but it is clearly my fault as i was the one that drove my 4runner and gave a nice one to the truck ahead of me. could the accident been avoided? of course as all accidents can be avoided. there were many factors that caused the accident ranging from miscommuncations, driver error, copolit error, lack of copilot, you name it I can name a bunch of things that went wrong but does it really matter now? all i can look back are on some of the images that bruce was able to compile at the accident scene as a grim reminder how fragile we all are and how in a blink of an eye things can go bad.

The biggest thing i've learned from this not the 'damn it you're driving too f'in fast' or 'why are you tailgating in the dust' or 'whatever else the reason for the accident' but rather the fact that in a blink of an eye my life could have ended. The night after recovering my 4runner and getting to Big Pine, CA and lodging at a hotel, all I can think all night was the fact that I was still alive and nobody got hurt. the impact was nothing like i've experienced before (note: i've rear ended a vehicle about 10 years ago going 25 and this impact was shockingly more severe).

We all gather to do various events whether it's slow or fast we get together to explore and have fun but I think we take for grant it that nothing will happen to us and all we can image are minor body damages or trail carnage from the environment. Never do we imagine that we'd get into a multi/solo vehicle accident that could potentially take a life. I really think that this accident was a wake up call for myself on really understanding the magnitude of how any event(s) can potentially turn sour. As much as we can assume things will be fine, we need to understand that these issues can arise and be prepared to conquer these incidents as you just never know. I've always said safety first but even at that things can go wrong. Having a safety procedure will be key on ensuring everyone is safe. if you plan to go out on an adventure with anymore, make sure you can trust your life with those around you as when things go sour they will be your lifeline on ensuring your survival.

[emptypockets]

The good news is that everyone is ok...well, except the Runner. You've gotta rebuild her Lance, or at least create another monster just like her! Sorry about that man!

[Marc P]

I say you ditch the LT kit and throw a Rockjock 60 under the front of that beast!!

[Good Times]

marc, look me up w/ all of the parts and i may consider it ;)

[ecchamberlin]

marc, look me up w/ all of the parts and i may consider it ;)


Oh My Stars! I cannot believe you would even consider that. Marc, I will help you. HAHA.

[91_4x4runner]

I say you ditch the LT kit and throw a Rockjock 60 under the front of that beast!!


The RockJock 60 looks like a huge, low clearance target.






But if you were rolling 49's it wouldn't make a difference! =)

[91_4x4runner]

I say you ditch the LT kit and throw a Rockjock 60 under the front of that beast!!


The RockJock 60 looks like a huge, low clearance target.






But if you were rolling on 49's it wouldn't make a difference! =)

[ecchamberlin]

As much as I have been able to do with my IFS rig, a solid axle for rock crawling is just plain better. Not even Toyota disputes that. High speed stuff is another story and nobody disputes that IFS has it all over a solid axle for the high speed stuff.

That 60 is darn near bullet proof.

[Seanz0rz]

i had an arguement with the sales rep from donahoe about this... hes like my ifs can go where ever your solid axle goes, but youre not invited to do the highspeed stuff. i responded with, thats fine, you can drive around the mountain, ill go over it.

i will someday sas my rig, or another, even with ifs i HATE the fast stuff. im not a rally driver. maybe with my future wrx, but not my 4runner. i enjoy crawling. that and it puts my mother at ease just a bit more if i dont do the fast stuff.

[Marc P]

"The RockJock 60 looks like a huge, low clearance target."

Ha, thats funny....maybe if you run 31's!!

Lance, I am sure you will make it bigger and badder than before...I still remember our first time out when the only mod you had was the roof rack and CB.

[Robinhood4x4]

I recently had an opportunity to talk with a retired GM engineer who now does crash investigations. He said it take a lot for an airbag to go off. I didn't ask him about aftermarket bumpers, but he said usually if the airbag didn't go off then you didn't need it. I don't think any conclusions about airbags and aftermarket bumpers can be made from this incident.

[ecchamberlin]

I agree. Just thought I would ask. I know I have come down on my TJM really hard a few times and it made me wonder how many times I would get away with abusing it.

Personally I dont think an aftermarket bumper would make a marked diff in head on collisions. The sensors are not in the bumpers or even the front cross members. I think if anything it would make the airbags deploy more quickly because they would transfer the impact energy more directly instead of some of it being absorbed by stock crumple zones. IMHO

[bamachem]

I agree. Just thought I would ask. I know I have come down on my TJM really hard a few times and it made me wonder how many times I would get away with abusing it.

Personally I dont think an aftermarket bumper would make a marked diff in head on collisions. The sensors are not in the bumpers or even the front cross members. I think if anything it would make the airbags deploy more quickly because they would transfer the impact energy more directly instead of some of it being absorbed by stock crumple zones. IMHO


and that's exactly why the aftermarket bumpers are "Non-Airbag Compliant". it's thought that they could make the shock of an impact more severe on the frame, and therefore prematurely set off the airbags. however, at the same time, the occupants are also feeling that increased shock, so the "danger" is nil. however, if an aftermarket bumper were to induce premature airbag firing in small-time fender-benders, then w/o that warning, they would be fair game for litigation by the insurance companies and owners who have to pay $1000+ per airbag for replacements.

also, to be deemed "airbag compliant" via the US DOT, the vehicles have to undergo chrash testing w/ the bumper installed. it's not too feasible to crash $30k+ vehicles to get the rating when they can add a sticker as a way around the requirement.

for the most part, those stickers on the aftermarket bumpers are nothing more than a CYA from litigation.

[BruceTS]

In this case the wind direction was blowing directly back on the road, so visibility wasn't the greatest. Dust lights were mandatory, usually it was easy to tell how far ahead the other vehicle is by the plume of dust, but when the lead vehicle slowed down he created less, we normally get on the radio to let others know. What happened after this is simple, Lance didn't see a huge dust cloud ahead, so he kept the pace up around a small bend in the road, at this time he glanced away, possibly looking at his GPS. By the time he saw the other vehicle stopped in front of him, it was too late to do much. He did manage to slow down enough to minimize the impact, which was slower than Lance can remember, I got to see part of the impact. Because of this the sensors didn't set off the airbags.

Personally I would have veered off the road into the sagebrush, but I'm sure Lance did what happens to most and that was to affixate on the rear of the other vehicle, by doing so you usually end up going in that direction. The other truck had very little damage, just a bent tube on the rear stinger.

Now why did Lances rig sustain so much damage, very simple the way the front bumper was mounted. there was a total of 5 bolts with thin washer mounting to the end of the frame. The bolts went through a slot in the bumper, on impact the washers simply pulled right through those slots. Basically the bumper wasn't properly attached, the reason is simple, this was a prototype bumper that was quickly installed for pictures and wasn't meant to be used. The additional bracing wasn't installed yet, so on impact it simply folded up. If the bumper was properly supported, he most likely would have been able to drive his rig out with just a bent bumper, instead it took out the radiator, clutch fan, both core supports, hood, all the lights, etc.......

BTW on more that one occasion I did tell Lance that his front bumper needed to be better braced. I know it will be next time..........

Lance's truck will be rebuilt........as for going fast it's fun, but there's more potential to do greater damage, my rig took it's toll and I'm currently repairing the broken rear suspension. Like I've said in the past, doing a SAS to a 4Runner is more for bragging rights, I'd rather build a buggy and be done with it.

[Ric]

i can totally understand desert driving, Ive done it for about 3 years in the Mojave desert.
so I can understand NOT seeing the other driver until you make contact, no matter how far behind you are, but I did it in tanks, at 40MPH, you just drive, stayin on the tank trail, following the dust, listening (on the radios) for anyone to say stop. lol if the tank/vehicle in front of you, dont let you know that they are slowing down, well, you can geuss what happens.
The important thing here is, NO ONE GOT HURT...

[cabbage]

Finally saw the photos today, they werent loading the day I saw this post, so I had no idea how bad it was..

Like everyone else says, the most important thing is, no one was hurt, you can always build another truck!(been there done that too many times :tapedshut:) And it really does make you think how close to loosing it all can be!

Lance, let me know if I can help out in any way!

[Jared]

BTW on more that one occasion I did tell Lance that his front bumper needed to be better braced. I know it will be next time..........


I'm sure he appreciates the "I told you so."

Glad to hear that you are okay Lance.

[turboale]

Damn Lance!
Glad you made it out ok!!

[ecchamberlin]

Yeah I told you so in this situation is kinda... well... Its Bruce! LOL

Austin,
Hows it goin? Heard you sold the Excursion. I will never forget you putting that thing sideways on dry pavement. Blew my mind. I need to see if I can get some more pictures from you from the tour.

[jrallan26]

Lance,

Sorry to hear about your truck. I am glad to hear you are okay. There are millions of Toyotas out there but only one Lance. I am sure you will build this truck or another even better.

[jrallan26]

Any update? Have you been able to inspect your truck? Insurance going to cover any of this?

[Good Times]

No relevant updates right now. I've been slowly removing parts or rather mangled mess. I'm planning on tubing the front end and removing much of the stock parts so it's gonna be some time before it's back on the road. Looks like I'm going to be looking for a lot of new stuff to replace the front end. eek!

[Marc P]

I didn't see any other pics from that run, but stumbled on this...looks like despite the accident, it was a fun...fast run

http://www.chaosfab.com/07nv/07nv.html

http://www.chaosfab.com/07nv/day2/07nv-d210.jpg

[Seanz0rz]

that is an awesome picture!!!

lance, as with everyone else, if you need anything that i can offer, just give me a call!

[BOVADS]

MAN SORRY TO HEAR ABOUT THE MIS HAP. i know im a little slow finding out. just wanted lance to know that his green runner is the reason i bought mine and i am trying to build it about same way.

[Good Times]

thanks for the compliments :) if you need help or some directions on how you want to build your 4runner, feel free to create a new thread and post all of your q's. I'll try to answer them as best I can and I'm sure others will chime in too. Welcome to Ultimate Yota.

[Texas Jim]

I know this is kind of tacky to ask you Lance, but leave it to me to ask the tacky, so here goes!

I see you didn't reply if your insurance was going to cover your accident???

That leads me to believe that they will not? Would you feel offended if some of us kicked a few bucks at you to help you get started??? TJ

[Good Times]

I have not had a chance to contact them and unfortunately it's been too long now that I highly doubt that will happen. The accident was clearly my fault so I'm not going to go after them and try to nickel and dime them. Also it was not on pavement so that clearly becomes a gray area. I know insurance is there for these reasons but since it's now more of a time issue I just don't want to pursue it.

I'm going to try to repair it myself with the help of local friends so we'll see how it all unfolds. At this point the 4runner is a big pile of metal in my driveway so it's definitely not going anywhere. Worst case would be to part the sucker but there's still hope on a full recovery. Unfortunately I've been swamped with personal stuff so the 4runner has really taken a back seat.

Thanks for the offer on the few bucks but I would not be able to accept any $$ from my fellow friends/families/members of UY. I'm really honored that you'd be willing to buck up but I would much rather have you use those bucks to support the UY vendors (some of which are great non-profit organizations here to preserve nature). Without them, this forum would not be able to survive. Plus you'll get something in return whereas if it came to me you won't see much.

[BruceTS]

In a few months I should have a tubing bender, so I convinced Lance to over-look his options again. Even linked another thread with a similar front end build-up that I would like to see done. Just wait for the new and improved version to hit the trails.....

[wifesaysimadumbass]

lets have a benefit concert for lance's rig i can get these guys to play for us
http://images.art.com/images/products/regular/10045000/10045786.jpg
man i always hear about this stuff way too late bruce told me about it in big bear you 'll fix it. i can buy you a beer next time when we go on our run after it's done

[Good Times]

mikey, i've got that beer holder that you gave me from the last bb trip :) it'll be waiting for a cold one!

[Chaplain]

Wifesays... your not the only one that is slow on the status of Lance's famous 4Runner. I just read this thread.

Lance, hope the 4runner rebuild project is off the ground at this point and if you make a motor cage make sure it tobe duplicated and sold. Some of us might be into that. Its something how God has a way of reminding us just how precious our life is and what have we really ever done to earn one breath of it. Glad your ok and were with ones you trust that got you out.

God speed,
Chaplain Steve
Racers For Christ
Rockcrawlers For Christ
www.teamrfc.org