Truck leaning, need opinions and help soon!!

[RunnerUp]

Hey guys, I searched and searched on that "other" board to no avail. My truck has been leaning to the drivers front for about a month now and swaying bad at highway speeds. I orignally assumed that it was the shocks and springs up front being worn out, and after some confirmation from that "other" board, I went ahead and replaced the front suspension with the same OME stuff I had on before. This did NOTHING for the lean or the wobble. So then I take it to get it aligned hoping that it is the problem... fixed it somewhat for about a day, still was leaning about an INCH on the drivers front side.

Fast forward to today, I am fed up with not being able to go wheeling because all my spots are an interstate trip away, so I take it to Toyota for their 42.50 diagnostic fee. They come back and tell me, well, you need a new passenger inner tie rod for $340... (I almost started laughing at them...) then your also going to need BOTH upper AND lower control arms for the rear axle because they are worn out and the axle has shifted an INCH (sound familiar?) to the passenger side. This one I didnt know much about, so after some quick research at home, I discovered a Sonoran Steel adjustable panhard bar would most likely fix the alignment issue, and just to be safe, order the unbendable DOM lower links he has also. Toyota wanted $840 to replace the parts, I can do it myself for $425 (sound better? I sure thought so). Then, they tell me my transmission mount is worn out/busted/broken whatever they said it was, and that it would be $350 to fix that. I didnt know anything about this either, so after a little more research I discovered the actual part was about $80 and looks to be attached by all of about 4 bolts.

So my questions to you guys and girls is, do you think the leaning could be contributed to the rear axle being so far off center? Could it be due to the tranny mount? Is this the only tranny mount?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/Transmission%20Mount/transmissionmount008.jpg

How hard is that to replace by myself or with a buddy helping me?

[04 Rocko Taco]

It COULD be a rear axle issue, I wouldnt put all my money on that though, definitely a bigger contender for the wobble cause though. You sure you have those OME's on the correct sides? All the wieght is on the driver (you and the gas tank) so one spring is usually longer than the other, but some lean is relatively inevitable.

Consequently, I dont think the lean is caused by the tranny mount, but if it is broken, it very well could lead to your wobble also.
from the pic it doesnt look broken/busted/worn out to me...

Did they give you any other details?
and yes that is the only mount for the tranny. and yes its like 4 bolts into the tranny, and one into the crossmember. Check out 4XInnovatios new tranny mount, it may be what you are looking for. (www.4xinnovations.com)
...Also one way or another, it should be easy to replace. :)

[BruceTS]

I'm totally confused?????

For starters nothing you mentioned would cause the leanning issue, possibly the springs were put in on the wrong side.(left spring vs right spring)

As for wobble, a worn out tie rod could cause the problem

If that image is of your transmission mount, I can't see anything wrong with it, unless the rubber is separated from the metal frame. I can't see how the links on the rear are worn and they claim it's off to the passenger side???? Usually lifting will offset to the drivers side....

[RunnerUp]

hahaha, your confused... just imagine me!!!

okay, i dont think its the springs being on the wrong side, because it was leaning before i replaced them.

i plan on replacing the inner tie rod as soon as possible to eliminate that as a possibility in the wobble

whenever you let off the gas or get on it, it feels like the truck is lurching up on the left driver side.

when you are physically behind the vehicle, you can actually see the axle being mis aligned

Chris, I couldnt find a transmission mount at 4x, only a transfer case mount, am i just not seeing it?

here is a picture of the tranny mount showing a little bushing that isnt connecting to the bottom piece... is this what you speak of?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/Transmission%20Mount/transmissionmount005.jpg

[Good Times]

been in an accident? frame bent?

the infamous lean - I agree that you probably have the wrong coil on the wrong side. Try swapping the all 4 corners and see if this fixes the problem. worst case go back to stock and see if the lean exists. on a side note did you install a body lift on just one side only? just wondering (doubtful but i gotta ask - too many unknowns)

replace any boots that look worn - steering, arms etc

are any of your rear links bent? if so this could be the culprit on the axle being misaligned. when you lift the rear will get misaligned but nothing extreme so either your links are bent or your frame/axle is bent.

the tranny mount looks fine so don't bother there. that'll be your last option.

[RunnerUp]

havent been in any accidents recently, and this is a fairly recent occurance. as i said before, the truck used to sit level, then one day for no apparent reason, it sagged. no changes were made, i replaced the springs and the shocks, still no change.

i am really starting to wonder about the left front sagging an inch and the rear axle being shifted to the passenger side by an inch... is this just coincidence or something more?

[Good Times]

i'm sure you don't want to hear this but i highly recommend you remove your suspension (all 4 corners) and visually inspect to make sure the right height coil is installed. i still believe the coils are not installed correctly and it just took a bit longer before it seated and now showing the lean.

the axle shift is a coincidence so i wouldn't worry about it. the lift is most likely causing the axle shift which is no biggie. we all experience this.

[RunnerUp]

okay, lets be clear, i am COMPLETELY willing to remove the suspension on all 4 corners and visually inspect everything. so im not sitting down here thinking you all are idiots, quite the opposite, which is why i posted this here.

these are the known facts. i had the OME 2.5" kit with the heavy duty front springs/shocks on my truck for 70,000 miles. truck sat very level, never had an issue. then about 2 months ago, the wobble on the interstate started happening and the lean appeared. nothing changed, no new tires, no new anything. one day it was fine, one day it leaned. in mid january i took my truck to north carolina to do some snow camping. it was sitting level then, then around mid feb or early march, it started all these issues. so something changed, i just dont know what yet.

i am really not thinking it is the springs on this one guys, give me a reason to believe otherwise, and i will check them out first thing tomorrow. again, i am not trying to be a smart ass on this, i just dont see how it could be the springs

[RunnerUp]

The problem is the axle won't be shifted to the passenger side with a lift, it'll only be a 1/2" difference to the drivers side, that's 1/4" out of alignment. Check to see if your missing a bolt in one of the top links or a upper rear shock mount busted.


no missing bolts and no busted shock mounts,

so why is my axle shifted to the passenger side? not only did toyota tell me that it is shifted to that side, but the local alignment shop did and you can VISUALLY see it, ill take a picture tomorrow to show you what i mean.

thanks again for all your help guys, it means more than you know to have such a wealth of knowledge literally at your fingertips

[BruceTS]

if you can visually see the alignment out on the rear, then that is the first place I'd look for your problem. Something in the back is way out of whack and should easily be seen. Since you can't find the problem and I can't see your rig, take a series of pictures of the rear suspension, all the link mounting points and shots of the links. You have to take the spare tire out for better reference.

The only time I've experienced the wobble you mentioned is when I lost a bolt out of one of the links.....

[RunnerUp]

i will take those pics tomorrow and post them up by early afternoon

[neliconcept]

panhard disconnected maybe? im starting to think maybe a spring perch shot off into the obliteration or something.

[BruceTS]

If the front is sagging, there is a possibility that you blew out a shock. Loss of nitrogen will cause that side to sag and give a feeling of a wobble going down the highway.

[neliconcept]

If the front is sagging, there is a possibility that you blew out a shock. Loss of nitrogen will cause that side to sag and give a feeling of a wobble going down the highway.


i think he bought new front shocks and springs though

[RunnerUp]

thats correct, brand new front shocks and springs

[BruceTS]

I know just tossing out ideas on what could cause the problem, since the problem is still there after the swap, the only other thing I can think of is a bent frame, but without actually seeing the rig who knows what it is. If it were at my house I'd have it figured out in second.

[neliconcept]

yeah this is confusing.

have you checked body mounts kyle?

[RunnerUp]

it would have to be a pretty bad bend in order to cause this much lean correct?

blake, i did check the body mounts, they are all symmetrical with one another as far as i can tell. there are only 8 body mounts on the 3rd gen right?

[neliconcept]

it would have to be a pretty bad bend in order to cause this much lean correct?

blake, i did check the body mounts, they are all symmetrical with one another as far as i can tell. there are only 8 body mounts on the 3rd gen right?



yeah 2 front, 2 rear and 3 on each side (6)

this really doesnt make sense inless you may have broken an engine mount or something too

[RunnerUp]

well toyota said my tranny mount is worn out, though no one else seems to think that is the case, however it is a cheap enough part i might just replace it just to do it.

i suppose i will check my motor mounts tomorrow, however you would think that toyota would check that out too when they discovered that my tranny mount is "bad" which is covered by a skid plate.

so am i correct in thinking that the rear control arms have almost nothing to do with ride height?

[RunnerUp]

here are the pictures of my truck before i replaced the front suspension, it looks pretty much the same now, cept the lean MIGHT not be as bad, i havent really measured it yet, keep in mind that the alignment was all out of whack when i took these, and it has since been aligned

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/trucklean001.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/trucklean003.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/trucklean002.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/trucklean006.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/trucklean005.jpg

[RunnerUp]

and just incase they might help, here are pictures of my rear suspension, taken before i replaced the front suspension, but to my knowledge, no one has touched the rear end, and when i looked at it today, it looked the same

driver side

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/rearsuspension007.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/rearsuspension008.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/rearsuspension009.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/rearsuspension010.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/rearsuspension011.jpg

[RunnerUp]

passenger side

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/rearsuspension001.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/rearsuspension002.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/rearsuspension003.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/rearsuspension004.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/rearsuspension005.jpg

[Good Times]

why is your rear coil binding? it looks like it's collapsed. or not?

your links (top/bottom for the rear attached to the axle) looks good. It's not bent nor are the mounts gone bad from these photos so we can rule that out. I'd like to see the mounts for the links to the frame to make sure it's solid there but based on what you've shown it looks ok.

[RunnerUp]

are you talking about this picture? where it looks like the top 3 or 4 coils sit directly on top of each other?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/rearsuspension004.jpg

[Good Times]

yeah is that normal? based on your sig it's an OME lift so I'm wondering if others with the same config looks the same.

just wondering.

[neliconcept]

i dont remember my coils touching like that when i had 891s, but im not sure.

could be the coil itself :/

[RunnerUp]

i didnt think it was normal, but both sides do that, about the same amount. could THAT be the cause of my lower front end?

lance, here are those pics you wanted...

passenger side

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/lowerlinks001.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/lowerlinks002.jpg

driver side

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/lowerlinks003.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/lowerlinks004.jpg

[Good Times]

cool looks like the links are all solid and the mounts are fine. the shock mounts on the rear looked solid too so we can rule that out.

hopefully someone else with the same coils can comment on the coil bind. the coils could be the wild card factor that's causing these issues. but it appears that both coils are doing it so that really throws in the curve ball.

i'm actually stumped. you think you can take photos of the front suspension? upper bucket (coil), lower arm mounts, upper arm mounts.

[neliconcept]

cool looks like the links are all solid and the mounts are fine. the shock mounts on the rear looked solid too so we can rule that out.

hopefully someone else with the same coils can comment on the coil bind. the coils could be the wild card factor that's causing these issues. but it appears that both coils are doing it so that really throws in the curve ball.

i'm actually stumped. you think you can take photos of the front suspension? upper bucket (coil), lower arm mounts, upper arm mounts.


from the way of it, it looks like the front is the factor, not the rear.

something up front has to be a problem.

[BruceTS]

Coils are fine, they are true progressive wound springs, so the top winds will be compressed...

Links look fine


Another thought a bent front sway bar......

[Seanz0rz]

mine leans passenger. still dont know why. might have something to do with the rear LC coils being different lengths, where as the new kits include both coils of the same length. i gotta call steve and see.

both front and rear swaybars are disconnected

[BruceTS]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/trucklean001.jpg

In this picture it seems like the suspension is level, but the body to frame is out of alignment, but hard to tell, need a closer shot showing the adjuster on the front frame in relation to the ground.

[RunnerUp]

okay, i could only get the passenger side and the mounts for the upper a arm on drivers side before the battery died, its charging now so hopefully i can get you guys the rest of the photos in 10-20 minutes

passenger side

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/frontsuspension001.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/frontsuspension002.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/frontsuspension003.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/frontsuspension004.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/frontsuspension005.jpg

[RunnerUp]

driver side upper a arm mounts

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/frontsuspension008.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/frontsuspension009.jpg

[RunnerUp]

Bruce, what do you want me to take a picture of? does it require me to stick a bottle or something under the front end so you can see if it sits level side to side to the frame?

[Good Times]

I bet your neighbors are probably wondering what in the world you're doing taking photos in the middle of the night eh :) :chair:

[RunnerUp]

lol, they prob. are, oh well

[BruceTS]

Basically I want to see the difference in frame height from side to side. Measure from the adjuster(lower A-Arm pivot points) to the ground. They seem level in the posted picture.

[Seanz0rz]

so if the frame is fine, what could be the problem? missing body mount bushing? or worse a broken body mount?

[RunnerUp]

they seemed to be pretty close together, but you guys tell me

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/frontframe001.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/frontframe002.jpg

[RunnerUp]

that picture makes it look like there is a big difference, but when i used a clothes hanger ( cant find my ruler or my tape... i hate moving around, i lose so much stuff!!) it was exactly the same on both sides, of course allowing a little for the redneck way of measuring

[BruceTS]

From the shot shown, there is definately a difference between each side, so that rules out body mounts. Disconnect the sway bar and see what happens, it could be bent.

[RunnerUp]

alright, thanks for the tip, ill do that tomorrow as soon as i get back from class. thanks a lot for your help tonight guys, maybe tomorrow ill go buy a new tapemeasure

[neliconcept]

alright, thanks for the tip, ill do that tomorrow as soon as i get back from class. thanks a lot for your help tonight guys, maybe tomorrow ill go buy a new tapemeasure


always good to have, second on the swaybar, that could make a huge difference

[4Runner202020]

mine was leanin and it was a sagged front spring. and this happened in 2,000 miles. so OME (arb) gave me a new set all around of springs...

[RunnerUp]

i would be inclined to believe it were a front spring also, but i just replaced them less than 200 miles ago, and it still sags... something else is the culprit here

i just got my new tape measure (damn those things are expensive!!!) and it measures just under 12" on both sides, perhaps one tick lower on the driver side (i am chalking that up to uneven ground surface/slightly different measuring place.

just sprayed some pb blaster on the sway bar links so i can disconnect it to see if that corrects the lean... i really am hoping its just a bent sway bar, but who knows at this point!

any more idea's while i go disconnect the sway bar and change rear diff fluid?

[neliconcept]

i would be inclined to believe it were a front spring also, but i just replaced them less than 200 miles ago, and it still sags... something else is the culprit here

i just got my new tape measure (damn those things are expensive!!!) and it measures just under 12" on both sides, perhaps one tick lower on the driver side (i am chalking that up to uneven ground surface/slightly different measuring place.

just sprayed some pb blaster on the sway bar links so i can disconnect it to see if that corrects the lean... i really am hoping its just a bent sway bar, but who knows at this point!

any more idea's while i go disconnect the sway bar and change rear diff fluid?


so under the frame its basically the same?

really confused now.

[Seanz0rz]

hence why i suggested missing or damage body mounts thats causing it to sag up front. but i dont know enough about how the body mounts to the frame.

[RunnerUp]

yep under the frame its basically the same...

the body mounts all look like their symmetrical partner

[RunnerUp]

okay, just a small rant... it seems that every bolt on my truck has seized up, and why does EVERY tire shop feel the need to do a "complimentary" fluid check and then use a torque wrench to put the bolts back on? i swear these people must not even change the settings from when they put the tires on with them, i can not get my rear diff fill bolt off worth anything, after two days of soaking it with pb blaster and i screwed my back all up trying at it. rant off...

now, what do you guys need pictures of while i wait for the pb blaster to help out the sway bar end links?

[neliconcept]

hence why i suggested missing or damage body mounts thats causing it to sag up front. but i dont know enough about how the body mounts to the frame.




up front body has a mount near the bumper bracket, and then one right behind the front tire that could be a culprit as well.

take pictures of the frame and mounts if anything.

also take pictures of other mounts near the front diff and what not.

[Seanz0rz]

for the rear diff bolt, i installed mine just hand tight last time, since i had a new one on the way after i rounded it off trying to get it out. when i went to replace it i had to again use a pair of channel locks with a pipe on the end of the handle to get it off... the hot/cold cycle really grabs ahold of that bolt.

as for pictures, not sure. what about the rear? it must be leaning too, could you measure from the hitch to the ground on each side?

[tulsa_sr5]

I'd just keep measuring different points on each side. Are the front L & R springs the same length? What about ground to frame rail at different points front to back.

I just sold my 3rd gen or i'd be looking at mine trying to help. Good luck, I know you have a ton of time and $ already thrown at this problem.

[RunnerUp]

okay, after nearly being killed by my skid plate i think i might have found something that makes sense to the wobble and the lean so correct me if im wrong

sean, the measurement to the rear frame section by the tow hitch is 10.5 or so on both sides, maybe a smidge lower on the passenger side

so here is what i found when i removed my skid plate

first thing i noticed was this random piece of broken plastic... who knows where that came from

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/Transmission%20Mount/missingmount003.jpg

second thing i noticed was what appeared to be a missing bushing or mount of some kind
the passenger side has it, the drivers does not

passenger

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/Transmission%20Mount/missingmount001.jpg

driver

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/Transmission%20Mount/missingmount002.jpg

[Seanz0rz]

that missing bushing will definitely cause vibration i think, regardless it needs to be replaced. as for the lean, not so sure about that.

that piece of plastic is likely one of the many clips that hold wiring looms to the inner fenders that break over time. i cant identify it off hand, but thats a logical conclusion to me.

here is a pic of mine before my diff drop:

http://i103.photobucket.com/albums/m141/hamiltoncomputers/Lift/DSC01859.jpg

[RunnerUp]

damn, i was hoping that could cause the lean, its the only thing that i can physically see, and my swaybar end links are still seized up, ive wound up using half a can of pb blaster on it and my rear diff bolt

[neliconcept]

go buy a breaker bar, will get it off for sure

[RunnerUp]

leverage is no longer the issue, its been almost rounded off now, so i guess some vice grips might work better, or just finish rounding it off... but, back on topic

what else should i be looking for that could cause the lean? im taking my computer out to my truck, so if you just randomly think of anything to check in the next 30 minutes or so before it gets dark here, let me know and ill check it out

[Good Times]

Kyle, did you get a chance to remove the swaybar?

[RunnerUp]

no not yet, ive never done it before, and so the bolts are seized up, i just tried again and they were still seized...

i sprayed some more pb blaster on it and will try again in the AM, it is getting too dark here to do any work on it.

did you see the pics of the mounts i posted on page 4? what is your thoughts on that?

[Good Times]

aside from the missing rubber bushing everything else looks fine. that could be the culprit on the wobbling.

try to get the swaybar off and see that resolves your lean. if it's not the swaybar i'm not sure where else to think off the top of my head.

[RunnerUp]

35 36

36 36.5

that is the height from the ground to the fender on all four corners just for everyones reference

[RunnerUp]

oh, and i have a lingering suspicion that the lean and the wobble are connected. granted i might be wrong, but they both appeared around the same time



Edit Rocko: Fixed Suspesnsion = Suspicion. Not the play on words we want to have in this thread. lol.

[tulsa_sr5]

Kyle, keep measuring, is the frame even all around? Springs?

[RunnerUp]

i will measure tomorrow, ill prob just mark 5 points along each side of the frame and take measurements..

thanks for the edit by the way, for some reason suspension is all thats on my mind lately

[YotaFun]

no not yet, ive never done it before, and so the bolts are seized up, i just tried again and they were still seized...

i sprayed some more pb blaster on it and will try again in the AM, it is getting too dark here to do any work on it.

did you see the pics of the mounts i posted on page 4? what is your thoughts on that?


Been following, and I am reading how your having issues with the sway bar links.
IF it is still seized, just cut them off and order quick disconnects. :D

The missing bushing on the diff mount sounds like it could be the culprit to the woobling.
I like everyone else am stumped on the lean, so I guess trying the swaybar would be your best bet at this point.

[RunnerUp]

haha, interestingly enough, i have a set of bolt cutters by my front door that need some breaking in...

[RunnerUp]

alright my friend is coming over tomorrow with an impact wrench since for some reason, i can not for the life of me get the sway bar endlinks unbolted. is this normal for it to be THIS difficult to get them unbolted? we just replaced my tranny mount yesterday and while some of those bolts were tough, they all came out sooner or later.

is everyone sure that the rear axle being pushed so far over to the passenger side wouldnt cause this? i mean, its easy to see how far misaligned it is.

looking at my sway bar, it doesnt LOOK bent, but tomorrow ill remove it just to rule it out.

[Seanz0rz]

id just put a breaker bar on them and snap the bolts off, if they are that bad, i wouldnt reuse them anyway. sway bar bolts can get bad because they are totally unprotected from the elements, where as the tranny mount is more protected that the swaybar bolts. have an angle grinder? :hillbill:

i didnt realize you axle was off center. it could be a problem if the axle is pulling down on the panhard bar, if the bar was level it wouldnt be a problem, but with a rear lift, that bar sits no where near level. if it is pulling, it would be pulling the left side down.

that being said. i find it very very hard to believe it is at fault for that much of a lean.

[BruceTS]

Like I said, if the rear axle is that far off that you can see it misaligned, then something is seriously wrong, unfortunately I can't tell you what is is unless I physically saw your truck.

[RunnerUp]

yes i do have an angle grinder, should i just cut the bolts off with that?

will that make the current endlinks unusable if i do that?

hmm, well toyota said that if i replaced my lower rear control arms, and my uppers that that would correct it, does that make any sense to you guys?

i was planning on buying some SS lower control arms and the trac bar from him this week or monday if you guys think that would fix the rear axle issue

[Seanz0rz]

when you did your lift, did you get a longer rear panhard bar, such as the adjustable one from steve at sonoransteel?

and yes, if you cut the bolts off, the endlinks will be destroyed, but it sounds like they might be anyway because of the corrosion on the threads. you are likely to break them when you put an impact gun on it.

[RunnerUp]

no i never got the longer rear panhard bar when i lifted.

i will try the impact gun anyways, because if they are reusable at all then i would like them to stay usable, if i break it with the impact gun then ill just use the angle grinder on the other side, theres nothing like lots of sparks after an oil change :)

[Seanz0rz]

im still not sure the panhard bar is the problem, but it is something that needs to be corrected regardless.

it might be worth disconnecting it on the driveway and maybe driving around the block slowly, hit some bumps, and come back and see if it still leans. it should be ok to drive at slow speeds with out the bar, blake did it recently unknowingly.

[BruceTS]

Take some shots of the rear, showing the misalignment, there should only be a 1/2" difference with lift, if so that won't cause your wobble. See if the rear suspension is loose, grab a wheel and move it foward and back.

So was the transmission mount rubber separated from the steel?

[RunnerUp]

its dark out now, so i cant get good pics of the rear tonight, but for the transmission mount, im not sure if the rubber was completely seperated, but it was def. cracked atleast 1/4 to half way through

[RunnerUp]

okay... got some pics of some stuff guys, had my friend chris help me get the sway bar off and it seems to have fixed the lean somewhat... tell me if you guys think these bushings could be the culprit

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/lean001.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/lean002.jpg


here are pics of the rear axle, tell me if you see anything out of the ordinary

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/lean003.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/lean004.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/lean005.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/lean006.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/lean007.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/lean008.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/lean009.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/lean010.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/lean011.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/lean012.jpg

new tranny mount

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/lean013.jpg

[RunnerUp]

and here are measurements of the ground to fender, the tape is stuck to 36"

front driver

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/lean019.jpg

front passenger

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/lean020.jpg

rear passenger

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/lean018.jpg

rear driver

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/lean017.jpg

[BruceTS]

Only thing I see is a rear disc brake conversion...... You may have to get a trim pack and adjust up the one side to level it out.....

[RunnerUp]

are trim packs a desired fix? i dont care if my lean is just like everyone elses, i dont need it to be perfectly level, i just dont want a substantial lean

do you think those sway bar bushings would cause the lean? i know they would cause the sway

[tulsa_sr5]

Looking at the tape measure pics it seems the front dr is a hair low, but basically everything is now level? Am I missing something?

[RunnerUp]

yeah, i just went and measured again, and the drivers side is even with the passenger side more or less (the truck is on a slanted road to the passenger side) and the rear end is basically the same, with the drivers side being slightly taller than the passenger side


is it a bent sway bar or those bushings?

[RunnerUp]

i suppose tomorrow im going to put the new bushings on and reinstall the sway bar to check if its the sway bar or if it was just the bushings

do you guys think those bushings were bad enough to cause that much lean??

[Erich_870]

Take some more pic's of your sway bar. Flip it over so it's laying flat. The sway bar should be symmetrical, but the pic you've posted doesn't show it well.

Erich

[RunnerUp]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/swaybar001.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/swaybar002.jpg

[mastacox]

Seems to me that if you removed your swaybar and the lean went away, you have found your culprit. Bad bushings couldn't cause any kind of a lean, only a bent swaybar could do that I think, since it would have to apply a fair amount of torsion. That might explain why the bolts were so hard to get off also, they were loaded. Did the swaybar appear to "spring" or jump in any way when you cut the first bolt off?

I wanna see pictures showing the rear axle offset to one side. What you should do is take a couple of pictures at the back of the truck showing each side a bit, so we can see how far the rear tires stick outside the body on each side.

Kinda like this:

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l70/mastacox/New4Runner065.jpg

[RunnerUp]

okay guys so this past week (known as my summer break because i now insist on getting my EMT-P certification) I drove carefully down to tampa and installed my new swaybar (def get your parts from toyota of dallas they are CHEAP!!!) but found that my truck had eaten one of my poly bushings for the endlinks. so i carefully drive my truck back up here and am ordering the new bushings today.

i also installed a new alternator because mine was squeeling and got a new second battery but forgot to turn in my old one for the disposal charge doh!

so i am hoping that once i get everything attached the lean and wobble are gone, otherwise i might just go insane with this.

just wanted to keep everyone up to date, and mastacox, ill get those pics for you as soon as i have a spare minute. thanks again everyone for all your help with this issue, hopefully this fixes it!

[RunnerUp]

okay, so i got the sway bar all put back together today and test drove it, wobble was still there, just as bad... so i take it to the local tire shop and have them balance the wheels, test drive it and the wobble is gone... sorta

on my 40 miles of road test, it wobbled a couple times, but always leveled itself out. so now im thinking that i either dont have the correct sway bar bushings or that the right inner tie rod is the culprit, what do you guys think?

[RunnerUp]

BTT

blah

[RunnerUp]

okay, so i gave up and took it to toyota. they said the whole power steering assembly was shot, so i got a new one under warranty installed. they aligned the truck (even though i told them not to) and guess what...

THE TRUCK STILL WOBBLES!!!!

i am at the end of my freaking rope right now, ive spent almost 3 grand on this truck in the past 3 months between the AC and this problem and it is still there.

here is a list of parts that i have replaced in search of this issue.

1. swaybar
2. swaybar endlinks
3. swaybar bushings
4. front springs
5. front shocks
6. outer driver tie rod
7. power steering rack
8. transmission mount

i have had the truck aligned twice and the wheels balanced once

i am taking it back to the tire shop tomorrow and telling them that if they dont fix the wobble that they need to give me a new set of tires ( i am already pissed at them because they put of fixing my brakes until the rotors were to worn to machine them and they dented a wheel kind of)

so ANY AND ALL suggestions to fix this wobble are welcome. if i can not fix it by the end of next week i WILL blow my truck up

[Seanz0rz]

they dented a wheel?!?!?! that could be your problem right there... how bad? pictures?

[RunnerUp]

its not a very bad dent, but its dented none the less

heres the pic

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/ATT00014.jpg

[tulsa_sr5]

don't think the wheel is the problem, but i guess you could swap the spare on just to see. You posted a pic a while ago of a worn out bushing/mount, has it been replace?
edit: this pic,
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/Transmission%20Mount/missingmount002.jpg


my last idea is the drivelines, any visible dents or severe scratches? is the lean fixed or close to it?

And dude, this sucks. It's the kind of problem i dread.

[RunnerUp]

i didnt think the wheel could be the problem either, but it still chaps my ass that they dented it.

i cant really swap the spare on because its still the stock size but i suppose i could swap front to back or something.

i have replaced all the worn out bushings and mounts that i could find.

as far as the drive lines, i dont know, ill get under and check them tomorrow morning. the lean is very close to being fixed but its not all the way there yet.

basically, if im driving down the interstate at 70mph, with cruise control on the truck will perform like it should for awhile and then for no apparent reason, it will start to wobble, but it always corrects itself after a couple of seconds.

any other idea's besides the drive shafts or wheel?

[RunnerUp]

oh, just saw your edit, yes i did replace that mount (and it was a big pain in the ass) i also replaced the other side just because.

and you are correct, this sucks bad... im getting really tired of not being able to drive my truck to the trail to wheel it.

[RunnerUp]

okay, tell me if this makes sense. the tire shop rebalanced my tires, realigned the truck, checked all the body mounts and bushings up front, couldnt find anything. i told them to check the back just to rule that out as well, and they found that my rear control arm bushings both lower AND upper, are shot and need to be replaced...

think that could contribute to the wobble at highspeed?

[RunnerUp]

bttt

[Seanz0rz]

could it cause a wobble, yes, though im no expert on these things. i think you would hear more of a clunking and such, but yes its possible to experience a wobble if they are truly shot and allow the axle to move in directions it was not intended to.

[RunnerUp]

i feel a clunk sometimes after i leave a stoplight, but not all the time. doesnt seem to by any rhyme or reason to it.

i dont understand what else it could be, i mean, basically the ENTIRE front suspension has been replaced by now so its my only lead. unfortunatly my bank account is REALLY hurting at this point in the search so i am trying to rule out EVERY other posssibility before spending another 400$ on my truck

so far ive spent a TON of money on my truck in the past few months

1. Fixed AC - $1000
2. New front suspension - $500
3. New swaybar with endlinks and bushings - $250
4. New tranny mount - $90
5. New power steering rack - $550 (the online company just refunded my money instead of honoring their warranty, so i went to advanced to get one)
6. New outer tie rod drivers side - $180

so thats 2,570 in 3 months, i would like to keep this under 3000 considering the payments for the new 07 still come every month

[Seanz0rz]

unless you have bent something on the frame, have a bad shock (could be the rear, but unlikely), a bent coil, an incorrect length on the panhard bar(though this really only makes the rear axle not centered, rarely does it work to pull one side of the truck down) you say the front suspension is all replaced/good, what about control arm bushings? do all of youre tires match? (make sure on this one, ive seen it happen before, go out and check each one) are they all properly inflated, or at least the same?

how bad are the bushings on the rear? could you take a pic?

[RunnerUp]

the leaning issue is totally resolved, it was a bent swaybar. so now the only issue is the wobble...

all the tires match up

ill try to take a pic of the rear set up but my camera cord is missing so it will be a crappy one with my phone, give me a few to go out and do that

[RunnerUp]

ok, so i borrowed a friends digicam and checked out the rear control arm bushings... which are no longer there, so i know that this is a problem but whether or not its the cause of my wobble is still undecided, anyone have a better idea?

lower control arm drivers side (front)
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/KylesRuner002.jpg

lower control arm drivers side (back)
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/KylesRuner001.jpg

upper control arm drivers side
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/runnerup/My%20Toy/KylesRuner005.jpg


you can also physically turn the control arms (lower) and when compared to my friends stock 4runner, you can see that the bushings are gone on my control arms.

so what do you guys think, think no bushings could cause the wobble?

also, toyota says its not possible to replace these bushings, and that i would have to buy new control arms, is that true?

oh and the passenger side looked similar to the drivers side as well.

[Seanz0rz]

if you can rotate those pieces with your hand, you deff need new bushings!!! will this fix the wobble, likely.

regardless you should have them replaced. as for them being a whole unit and not sold in parts, sounds right by toyota, but one of the LCA experts will have to chime in.

[RunnerUp]

just had to add something to the list of what is wrong with my truck....

7. Rear Differential and Gears are toast

think these control arm issues could destroy the diff?

[Bajabwk]

An idea, read something about a clunk and wobble leaving a stop light. for a few months a couple years ago i had a similar experience. turns out my electric rear locker never got completely disengaged from my last wheeling trip. so i was sticking as i accelerated from a stop.....try putting on your locker and then making sure you disengage it fully....just an idea

[Seanz0rz]

also lube your driveshaft...

[RunnerUp]

tried both suggestions, tried locking and unlocking the ARB to no avail... spent what seemed like FOREVER lubing my drive shafts but the noise remained. took the truck to 4WP and they have determined that my pinion cracked down the middle damaging my ring gear.

i had the locker and new gears put in last november and now 4wp wants to charge me $560 for labor and a new master install kit, does this seem absurd to any of you? keep in mind i had to pay $175 to get the truck towed back to the shop already. should i call corporate?

[Seanz0rz]

whats the warranty on the parts/labor? if you can show it was their fault for an incorrect install, then maybe youll have some luck. otherwise you are screwed.

[RunnerUp]

i got screwed of course, add it to the tab.

now the list of parts piling up to get installed next week is adding up

i have all 4 rear control arms, uppers and lowers to install that arrive on monday.
my lightforce 170's are getting here hopefully sometime this week after they warrantied them out
im replacing the front and rear sway bar bushings with new oem parts as im not sure the poly ones are the correct size.
my rotors are for the tundra brake upgrade are getting here today and im getting the calipers and pads tomorrow.


so hopefully after next week my truck will be running good again so i can take it out and wheel after months of sitting there doing nothing good.

[RunnerUp]

alright... so i wound up replacing the rear control arms... TOTALLY solved the wobble issue. had to pay 500+ for 4WP to replace the rear diff and gears and now... 2 months after they did that, guess what i find in my diff... GLITTER!!! oh wait, nevermind, those are metal shavings from the SECOND FAILING DIFFERENTIAL!!!!!!!

yes im pissed, im going by there tomorrow to see what they say, hopefully its something helpful.

[4runnerchevy]

WOW, I would just learn to set them up myself.

[RunnerUp]

yeah im contemplating it... unfortunatly i dont have the time to sink into that skill right now, so i am going to try and get them to pay for toyota to install them.