Hi-Lift vs Bottle Jack?

[glenyoshida]

When have you actually used your Hi-lift? I’m considering leaving my Hi-Lift at home since I have a winch and a bottle jack and wanted to see if I can find reasonable probability and reason to keep hauling it around with me. One of the few times I can think of needing a Hi-Lift is to put a body lift on but I already did that.

I’m looking for actual fist hand experience. When have you used it and in what scenario? Please only information when you’ve actually used it or you were there watching someone else use one.

It’s pretty well established that the off-roading community has accepted Hi-lifts as a standard piece of equipment so I realize this is going against the grain. I’m fine either keeping it in my rig or leaving it but if I can find a reasonable cause to leave it at home I’d happily save the weight and space that it takes up.

Again please only first hand experiences and not hearsay or theories. Thanks!

[4runnerchevy]

In your situation the only thing I can truly think of is jacking and pushing over a boulder. Or in a rear scenerio. Me, if I had a winch I would still carry it. They have been tie rods, drag links, frame fixes and used as fire pokers. Still carry a bottle jack, they have uses.

[randver]

i have used my hi lift to lift me off a rock i was high centered on. and have used it / had have to use it to change my tires. stock jack does not go high enough.

[oly884]

Being prepared is far more important.

I have used my hilift before to get off rocks, logs, etc, it is needed even on the road to help someone that you may encounter that IS stuck.

[Ric]

Pics or it didnt happen.. lol

I have NEVER used my hi-lift, and dont personally know anyone that "needed" to use it, once someone "wanted" to use it, just to say they did. But we had 2 winches, which would have done the job in a fraction of the time, and not risk damaging his rig.
I dont even take mine anymore, "Got winch" just sits in the garage.
I never wheel alone, we always have atleast one winch, to many straps to count, and plenty of rock stackers I mean people, lol 4 years of wheeling every weekend, Ive never seen a "need" for it. (the mall is pretty tame :rofl:)
winch + skid plates = no need for a hi-lift :D

[oly884]

Pics or it didnt happen.. lol

I have NEVER used my hi-lift, and dont personally know anyone that "needed" to use it, once someone "wanted" to use it, just to say they did. But we had 2 winches, which would have done the job in a fraction of the time, and not risk damaging his rig.
I dont even take mine anymore, "Got winch" just sits in the garage.
I never wheel alone, we always have atleast one winch, to many straps to count, and plenty of rock stackers I mean people, lol 4 years of wheeling every weekend, Ive never seen a "need" for it. (the mall is pretty tame :rofl:)
winch + skid plates = no need for a hi-lift :D


There are those times where we venture out on our own, or there are those people who don't have a winch. I suppose that if you have a winch and never go out alone you could possibly justify not carrying one. However, if you put yourself in situations where you could get stuck, I would always carry one. Your winch breaks, your buddy can't get to you, etc. It's not worth it to just say "I didn't need it"

[troyboy162]

i hate lugging it around too haha but unfortunatly im often the lone rig headed to some mine somewhere and i have no winch. other then just using it alot in the driveway i helped a guy put on his tire chains with it.

[Ric]

Pics or it didnt happen.. lol

I have NEVER used my hi-lift, and dont personally know anyone that "needed" to use it, once someone "wanted" to use it, just to say they did. But we had 2 winches, which would have done the job in a fraction of the time, and not risk damaging his rig.
I dont even take mine anymore, "Got winch" just sits in the garage.
I never wheel alone, we always have atleast one winch, to many straps to count, and plenty of rock stackers I mean people, lol 4 years of wheeling every weekend, Ive never seen a "need" for it. (the mall is pretty tame :rofl:)
winch + skid plates = no need for a hi-lift :D


There are those times where we venture out on our own, or there are those people who don't have a winch. I suppose that if you have a winch and never go out alone you could possibly justify not carrying one. However, if you put yourself in situations where you could get stuck, I would always carry one. Your winch breaks, your buddy can't get to you, etc. It's not worth it to just say "I didn't need it"

well I NEVER wheel alone, just to much can happen. everyone I wheel with, carries straps, most have a winch, (incase mine didnt work) snatch bocks, etc etc etc. like I said, in the 4 years of wheeling "every" weekend, I have never needed it, or seen anyone on a trail that "needed" it, thats why mine is baried in the garage, lol
Ive yet to see a picture of someone using a hi-lift, that needed a hi-lift, where a winch or straps couldnt have done the same thing, only faster and SAFER.

[T4Rfun]

For what's it's worth, my opinion is that a Hi-Lift is a valuable tool for the serious off-road rig. That's not to say that if you don't carry one you are not serious, or that my opinion is anything more than, well, my opinion.

I'd like to quote a paragraph written by Bruce Elfstrom of Overland Experts http://www.overlandexperts.com/ in an article he wrote in the Fall 2008 Overland Journal Magazine. By the way, if you don't already get the publication, do it today. Get a subscription, and I'd also suggest getting your hands on as many back copies as possible. http://www.overlandjournal.com/

Bruce Wrote:
Simple: The Hi-Lift does everything it's supposed to do, and more. It is reliable and bulletproof. It is basic-no computer needed to fix it. It is economical. It is indispensable. Along with learning how to drive well, carrying a first aid kit, wearing the correct clothing, and maintaining effective communications, the Hi-Lift jack is a must-have for any serious overlander. It will winch you out, lift you up, turn you over, clamp things together, or pull things apart. It's truly a jack of all trades-but only when used correctly and safely.

Get a copy of the Fall 2008 Overland Journal and read this article. It is very well written and informative.

Also check out Bill Burke's article on use of the Hi-Lift jack. http://www.bb4wa.com/articles/hilift_jack.htm

For me, recovery or repair of my vehicle on the trail is critical to being properly prepared for overland travel. Yes, there is always safety in numbers and that would be the preferred method of travel, but I still feel that it is my responsibility to be prepared for the trail. I've read comments that say that it isn't needed if you have a winch or tow straps and other vehicles with you. Well, it is of course easier and safer to use other methods of extraction prior to going to a Hi-Lift as a winch, but that isn't the Hi-Lifts primary use, and in the event you are without a winch, or your winch is inoperable and no vehicle can help, the Hi-Lift comes to the rescue.

The primary reason for the Hi-Lift is of course as a lift. On a loaded and lifted 4-wheel drive vehicle you are asking a lot of a stock jack or bottle jack if they would work at all in something as simple as a tire change off-road. Posts referring to the Hi-Lift as a tool to lift the truck high enough to recover a truck high-centered on rocks or other obstacles is one great example of using a Hi-Lift where few other options are available. In some circumstances you could pull or winch a high-centered rig, but it might not be the best choice especially if the obstacle is potentially going to cause damage under the vehicle or where that form of recovery might put the rig in an even more precarious position. Using the Hi-Lift to raise the vehicle as required to place rocks, logs, or whatever is available under wheels to allow you to drive off the obstacle is a safe method of recovery.

For those that write that they have wheeled for years without ever needing one, I would say that I've been wheeling for years as well and always carry a first-aid kit, but have to this day not needed to break it out. I won't go on even the simplest day trail run without a first-aid kit, and I am now taking the same attitude with my recovery gear. The Hi-Lift, being a critical part of that recovery gear.

The list of uses for a Hi-Lift is long, and the trail often presents us with unexpected challenges. I'll leave the skills training and the examples to people that are much more experienced and better trained to present that information. Read what Bill Burke has to say, and get a copy of The Overland Journal.

That's my two cents...OK, maybe more than two cents this time.

[L33T35T Tacoma]

My first time to pismo, and I think it was Casey's too (owner of the truck below). He was 2wd at the time. he got stuck and kept digging and digging. there was really no other way out. nobody had a winch, and it's very hard to tow uphill in the sand. we resorted to this and it worked.


http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c357/jlboggs/pismo0037.jpg

[oly884]

Pics or it didnt happen.. lol

I have NEVER used my hi-lift, and dont personally know anyone that "needed" to use it, once someone "wanted" to use it, just to say they did. But we had 2 winches, which would have done the job in a fraction of the time, and not risk damaging his rig.
I dont even take mine anymore, "Got winch" just sits in the garage.
I never wheel alone, we always have atleast one winch, to many straps to count, and plenty of rock stackers I mean people, lol 4 years of wheeling every weekend, Ive never seen a "need" for it. (the mall is pretty tame :rofl:)
winch + skid plates = no need for a hi-lift :D


There are those times where we venture out on our own, or there are those people who don't have a winch. I suppose that if you have a winch and never go out alone you could possibly justify not carrying one. However, if you put yourself in situations where you could get stuck, I would always carry one. Your winch breaks, your buddy can't get to you, etc. It's not worth it to just say "I didn't need it"

well I NEVER wheel alone, just to much can happen. everyone I wheel with, carries straps, most have a winch, (incase mine didnt work) snatch bocks, etc etc etc. like I said, in the 4 years of wheeling "every" weekend, I have never needed it, or seen anyone on a trail that "needed" it, thats why mine is baried in the garage, lol
Ive yet to see a picture of someone using a hi-lift, that needed a hi-lift, where a winch or straps couldnt have done the same thing, only faster and SAFER.



To each his own, however, given the thread title, I would say that a hilift is far more valuable than a bottle jack in just about any situation aside from pavement, but you can still make the argument that a hilift is just as useful. Something can be said for weight and space for a hilift, but to me, I'd much rather be prepared for any situation. If you get a flat, there's always the chance that a bottle jack is not going to be able to lift your truck high enough. Have a lift? Well, I know that a stock bottle jack wouldn't really up to the task to get my truck high enough without blocking it up. I can relate it to something else that I personally do:

I carry a gun for defense of me and those around me. I have never needed it, nor do I ever want to NEED it, but it does not keep me from carrying it. I sacrifice space, weight, and ultimately comfort when I carry it, but those factors do not keep me from carrying it. The same can be said for a hilift. I'd much rather have one in the truck and never need it as opposed to not having it in the truck and needing it. However with all this said, it comes down to comfort. If you feel comfortable not carrying one, then don't, but if you feel a need to carry one, then do so.

[4runnerchevy]

Don't leave the bottle jack behind, small and has a wonder of uses. Its a press, a spreader, a car jacker, and so on. I say carry them both.

[glenyoshida]

Here's a recovery that was posted on Colorado4x4
http://www.colorado4x4.org/vbb/showthread.php?t=153019
I still carry both and probably will keep doing so. It's big and a PITA but it is a tool that is hard to replicate.

[Scuba]

Looks like that guy got lucky..

[CJM]

Never be unprepared. What happens if the winch breaks, your alone, etc, etc. A hi lift and a bottle jack are indispensable imho.

[ecchamberlin]

I have used my hi-lift a few times for myself and a few times for others. I carry mine all the time. Flat tire changes all so fast if you have sliders and a hi-lift.

Winches do not solve every issue especially when hi centered. Dragin diff's and drive shafts over rocks as apposed to jacking it up and pushing the vehicle over side ways seems like a bad idea.

This is a non-issue question in my opinion for lifted/off road vehicles. Pic in signiture line link of mine in use to change the drivers front tire.

[04 Rocko Taco]

I don't carry a bottle jack. I would be lost without my Hi-lift. To change tires in my garage I have to have the hi-lift. I very rarely wheel alone, and when I am with others there are many winches and straps, but I feel better knowing my hi-lift is there....

I've personally used my hi-lift to change more tires than I can count, fix a transfercase on the trail, move a couple of high centered trucks, to winch my truck on occasion, and even just have a place to hang my hat.

IMHO, it is an indispensable tool. There is no reason not to carry it. I have a dedicated trail rig, and I like to run the "hard stuff" as such, I am prone to breakage, I understand this, its a fact of this hobby, hell its almost a way of life. I feel more prepared for myself and others by having one with me. Sure tihs sport is about helping others, and almost everyone is willing to do so in your time of need, but that doesnt mean you shouldnt help yourself. Carry your hi-lift.

[4x4mike]

I'm not sure I'd get next to this even it were on 2 hi lifts and 2 bottle jacks.

[ecchamberlin]

I do still carry the bottle jack though.

Hi Lift. Never leave home without it!

[BruceTS]

I've used the piss out of my Hi-Lift...there's no way I'd be able to change my tire without one, even then I stll have to chain my rear axle.

Mine is so worn in, that it works real smooth. Daily driving, mine stays at home, local wheelin if in a big group sometimes I leave it at home, but most cases it comes along.

[WATRD]

Somehow, my Hi-Lift finds it's way into use for something almost every trip. It's the only thing I have tall enough to change a tire on my rig on the trail, but thankfully, that is an infrequent event.

Believe it or not, the sum of it's parts is greater than the whole. That is, it seems to get taken apart and used for something more than it gets used as a jack/winch. The handle makes a great substitute for a bent tie-rod/drag-link, the main beam replaced broken leaf springs and so on. Carrying a Hi-Lift, along with basic supplies, is like having an auto parts store with you on the trail.

[Ric]

just today, I got a flat on the trail, the bottle jack did just FINE.

[glenyoshida]

Yep, the more I learn the more I think an equally suitable name for this thread could be "Air vs Water. Which is more important to have?" I keep being reinforced that they are different and ya need both.

For example when I change my CV on the trail I need the Hi lift to jack it up and the bottle jack to push down the A arm.

[coronan]

Does any one carry a leatherman daily?

My buddy carried a leatherman for years. He used it all the time. Then he lost it. Funny thing was; he no longer needed it all the time.

It seams that, such is the case of the HiLift. ... And if you really needed one; Isn't every other yahoo carrying one?

[Ric]

Does any one carry a leatherman daily?

My buddy carried a leatherman for years. He used it all the time. Then he lost it. Funny thing was; he no longer needed it all the time.

It seams that, such is the case of the HiLift. ... And if you really needed one; Isn't every other yahoo carrying one?






X2

[glenyoshida]

If you are coming from a point of need vs want then I suppose you could use that kind of logic with just about anything. Cell phones, cars, lights, etc. You can get by without any or all of them but it's harder to argue that it's better without them.

Since I originally started this thread I've had the luck of being able to run many, many trails and I still carry both. If I had to leave one of them at home it'd be the bottle jack. The times I've used my bottle jack for my own rig was to push down the A arms when changing out a CV axle but since then I've found out that it's not necessary if your A arms are adjusted to the correct ride height. You can also loosen them up on the trail if you don't have a bottle jack.

I've helped change so many CVs that imagining changing out an axle without a hi-lift makes me groan. Hi lifts are big and heavy but as someone that has a few trails under my belt I can say that they are very useful and when you need one there's really no good substitution.

When I started this thread I was trying to find a good enough reason to not carry a hi-lift but in the end came to accept that there really isn't a good reason to not have one. I spent a little extra time to make a new mount for mine and now it's not even a consideration. When I'm on a trail it's where it should be, with me. Maybe some new knowledge or a better tool will come out but until then I keeping my hi-lift, heavy, bulky and all.

As far as the logic that a lot of other people have one... do you really want to be "that guy"?

Here's my latest high lift mount. It's got two stainless steel cradles that hold the hi-lift on the carrier arm and then a single knob as an extra measure of security. Works like a champ. It's secure, controls the rattles, and is easy to get remove and remount. The new mount takes care of my main complaints of space and easy access.
http://i126.photobucket.com/albums/p100/glenyoshida/2012/120411%20Kokopelli/DSC_1844.jpg

[Ric]

Back when I use to wheel in groups, I never carried one, for the simple fact that has already has been post, AND, Im not/wasnt snapping axles every run, I have used (my) hi-lift ONCE on a trail, (popped a bead) and yes, there was about 4 other hi-lifts there that day, lol
Now that I chose to wheel with a very select few, or just myself and one other, I do carry mine, BUT Im not snapping CVs every other run either, so Im not needing it on every trail :thumbup:
IF I was to wheel with a group larger than 4 rigs again, the hi-lift will prob stay home.

if comes down to, if you have it, and want to carry with you, do it..