Should cell phones be banned while driving?

[oly884]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/28627708/

What's your take? Should cell phones be banned while driving?

My take, NO (surprise, surprise...)

Cell phones don't make people bad drivers, they were already bad drivers. The cell phone is not what caused the accident, the driver did. A responsible and good driver knows that talking on the cell phone on a twisty road, in heavy traffic, etc is a bad idea. However, driving on a big, flat highway during the day, keeping your eyes ON THE ROAD, is probably not going to hurt anyone.

Now, I'm not against increasing a fine if the driver caused the accident due to being distracted by a cell phone. But banning them all together? Come on, we have more common sense than that, or do we?

It's always sad when a person is hurt or killed in a car accident, especially when it could have been easily avoided in the cases of people simply not paying attention due to cell phones, gps's, etc. But, is it necessary to penalize everyone? I have not taken cell phone calls several times (even with a stupid bluetooth) due to road conditions, traffic, etc.

What is worse is that if this passes, what is next? Do we ban radios/CD players because those distract people? Where does it stop, or does it stop? It's a slippery slope folks.

[slosurfer]

Yeah, I think they should stick with what they have now in CA, which is no texting and no handheld. A ban on hands free is rediculous.

What is the difference between talking on your bluetooth and talking to your passenger? Pretty soon you'll be banned to driving by yourself so there are no distractions. :laugh:

[oly884]

What is the difference between talking on your bluetooth and talking to your passenger?


I heard the argument that the person you're talking to "isn't aware of what is going on around you"

Meaning: The person on the other end of the line can't see where you are, if there's traffic, etc.

Which makes a case, but once again, it's taking the blame away from the driver. 100% of accidents caused by someone talking on their phone could have been avoided had the PERSON not picked up the cell phone. The cell phone did not cause the car to swerve, or the car to not hit the brakes, the PERSON did those things because they were distracted.

The more the government tries to prevent idiots from doing idiotic things, the more we will loose our freedoms. Laws can't fix stupid.

[mYnAmEiSmUdD]

The more the government tries to prevent idiots from doing idiotic things, the more we will loose our freedoms. Laws can't fix stupid.


:lol:

Is it just me or does it seem that a lot of legislature negates responsibility from stupid people?

I agree with ya Oly. It seems pointless to punish the masses on account of a few dumbasses... :headscratch:

(on a side note i saw you downtown pulling out of a parking lot on 7th a few weeks back. I knew that rig was familiar... :thumbup:)

[oly884]

The more the government tries to prevent idiots from doing idiotic things, the more we will loose our freedoms. Laws can't fix stupid.


:lol:

Is it just me or does it seem that a lot of legislature negates responsibility from stupid people?

I agree with ya Oly. It seems pointless to punish the masses on account of a few dumbasses... :headscratch:

(on a side note i saw you downtown pulling out of a parking lot on 7th a few weeks back. I knew that rig was familiar... :thumbup:)


Haha, yup, that was me. Were you the one who made the comment when I was pulling out?

[mYnAmEiSmUdD]

Roger roger.

I was about to stop and ask you if you were on UY but decided against it.

It would have been rather awkward (butchered spelling... wow more coffee anyone?) if it had not been you....

/hijack:

What is next? I won't be able to smoke while driving?

[Good Times]

No no the next thing they'll ban is eating and drinking. Or maybe even using the gps navigator or hell the radio/ac controls!

They might as well implement auto pilot/driver technology so these stupid laws can get removed!

I tell ya we have way too many laws as it is. I can bet that we're all breaking something we don't even know... how lame is that?

[oly884]

For those of you who say yes, please offer explanations as well. I'd like to hear your views on this matter.

[Nuthuts96]

Is it just me or does it seem that a lot of legislature negates responsibility from stupid people?

I agree with ya Oly. It seems pointless to punish the masses on account of a few dumbasses... :headscratch:


"few" would be a stretch... :) in all honesty, i think the perception of safety (for me, anyway) went up after the ban in june. one of the scariest scenarios i saw myself involved with (time and time again!) was a little old lady on a phone. usually 5-10mph under the limit on SB I-5 between exits 169-165. i don't care who you are, that is SCARY.

since august i've been in burlington, vermont, land of the ban-free phone laws. BUT, i've seen more close calls/rear ends with phone users than anything else (can't comment on the hands free). granted, i haven't been in the area for that long to objectively account for their driving habits alone, from what i've seen so far, another distraction (phone, baby crying, changing the radio station...) is not something the average vermonter is equipped to handle, imo, of course.

the point- i support hand held phone bans. i found that using a hands free device that wasn't already in your ear/ready to use with the push of a button problematic. like the wired single-ear headphone that i had to find dangling from the phone, insert in ear, push the button to answer the call, all the while dodging little old ladies gabbing away, intruding on my lane...

after that, shore up the slippery slope with some rebar and 2x4s! :drink: cheers to the left coasters

[oly884]

Is it just me or does it seem that a lot of legislature negates responsibility from stupid people?

I agree with ya Oly. It seems pointless to punish the masses on account of a few dumbasses... :headscratch:


"few" would be a stretch... :) in all honesty, i think the perception of safety (for me, anyway) went up after the ban in june. one of the scariest scenarios i saw myself involved with (time and time again!) was a little old lady on a phone. usually 5-10mph under the limit on SB I-5 between exits 169-165. i don't care who you are, that is SCARY.

since august i've been in burlington, vermont, land of the ban-free phone laws. BUT, i've seen more close calls/rear ends with phone users than anything else (can't comment on the hands free). granted, i haven't been in the area for that long to objectively account for their driving habits alone, from what i've seen so far, another distraction (phone, baby crying, changing the radio station...) is not something the average vermonter is equipped to handle, imo, of course.

the point- i support hand held phone bans. i found that using a hands free device that wasn't already in your ear/ready to use with the push of a button problematic. like the wired single-ear headphone that i had to find dangling from the phone, insert in ear, push the button to answer the call, all the while dodging little old ladies gabbing away, intruding on my lane...

after that, shore up the slippery slope with some rebar and 2x4s! :drink: cheers to the left coasters



I will agree that bluetooth devices don't necessarily help if it's not already in your ear (and we all know how great they feel to leave in your ear...)

However, bad drivers will be bad drivers. Once again, I point out that had the driver of an accident, caused by distraction, not picked up the phone, it would have been avoided. It's not an easy issue to deal with, but an outright ban on cell phones while driving won't really 'fix' the problem.

A dumbass who is distracted by a cell phone will only be distracted by something else (radio, food, baby, pet, other person in car, make-up, shaving, etc.)

[habanero]

Yes. I park before I use mine. I'm a cyclist with too many friends and acquaintances who've been hit by people using their cell.

[Ric]

YES.. Ive almost been hit too many times to count, buy people trying to talk on the phone or texting while driving.

[oly884]

Hab, that's a personal choice. Like I said, stupid people will always be stupid. Banning cell phones perhaps could have prevented accidents that your friends have had, but what about food, GPS, etc? A good driver is better at driving with one finger than a bad driver with both hands on the wheels.

Once again, this all boils down to personal responsibility. I talk on my cell phone when driving, not in heavy traffic, not on curvy roads, and not when there is a sheet of ice on the ground, it's pretty easy to know when and when you should not talk on your cell phone while driving. If people are too stupid to know the difference, then THEY ARE THE ONES WHO NEED TO PAY THE PRICE. Not the law abiding common sense oriented citizen.

But, I'm sure it will pass, then it'll be food, then GPS devices, radios, on and on. Welcome to the age where the government is going to run your life.

A little story for you guys: Back in bozeman there was a guy with "HANG UP AND DRIVE" plastered across his rear window in his truck, all the way across, big bold letters. This guy was the biggest asshole I've ever met. He tailgated, cut off, and was generally a POS when it came to driving. I personally was almost hit by this douche.

"but wait David, he wasn't talking on a cell phone, in fact he's against talking on the cell phone while driving..."

Right, but once again, I'll point out that bad drivers will ALWAYS be bad drivers. Cellphones don't cause the accident, PEOPLE DO. This guy was the classic example of what I'm talking about, they are taking a problem, and removing blame from the people and putting it on a device.

Is it the gun that decides to murder someone? Is it the car that runs the red light? Is it the alcohol that magically goes into someone's stomach? Do I really need to continue?

This law is removing blame from people. You hit someone on a bike while talking on your cell phone, then you pay the price as you were clearly being reckless. You rear end someone because you were on a cell phone, then you are to blame because you were not paying attention. It's REALLY that simple folks. If people were pulled over for driving like idiots more, due to cell phones or not due to cell phones, then the message would get out that "DON'T DRIVE LIKE AN IDIOT."

[Good Times]

This law is removing blame from people. You hit someone on a bike while talking on your cell phone, then you pay the price as you were clearly being reckless. You rear end someone because you were on a cell phone, then you are to blame because you were not paying attention. It's REALLY that simple folks. If people were pulled over for driving like idiots more, due to cell phones or not due to cell phones, then the message would get out that "DON'T DRIVE LIKE AN IDIOT."


exactly!

[CJM]

I feel the same way as Oly, they were already a bad driver to begin with.

Also due to my job I constantly use my cell/work pager/cell thing and yea I aint perfect but im better than 99% of them out there. Not only do I talk on my phone, but I need to work the pager one like a computer, and I have a 2 way to contend with and other people calling me on my cell. I have had close calls, but I never really wrecked anything besides the time I was sick and passed out behind the wheel.

In all honesty bad drivers are just bad and really annoy those of us who can drive well. I am no stranger to accidents-but every one that was on a real road (backing into someones car who parked DIRECTLY behind you isnt exactly your fault..what idiot parks behind a driveway??) Were caused by the other drivers.

If the speed limit in my area says 50mph, people do 55-60mph, do 40-45 and most people will pass you even if its a double line. Thats a major problem, if you cannot comfortably drive the way everyone else does let faster traffic pass. Its amplified 100 fold on a cell, but then again putting on make up, texting, playing with your thumping sound system or using your gps isnt good either. Hell, do you know statistically women (and those who are over cautious moreso) cause more accidents than guys do?

But in the end cell phones make bad drivers even worse, really if your not paying attn to the road then dont bother driving. Its like people and snow here, if its snowing and you can only crawl along get out of the way for those of us who have 4wd and know how to drive in the stuff? How is it I can safely do 25 and you cant get over 10?

[Ric]

This law is removing blame from people. You hit someone on a bike while talking on your cell phone, then you pay the price as you were clearly being reckless.
IMO thats a whole other issue. DO NOT freakin ride a bicycle on the highway... if you do, knowing that there are drunk drivers out there, people not paying attention, etc. and you do it anyways :headscratch:
I can still hear my mom yelling at me, "get out of the street, your going to get hit"
thats all im gonna say about that (forrest gump)

[CJM]

I know how you feel Ric, we have a large population of illegals here and they all ride bikes all over. I swear if another one of them cut me off im running them down.

[gabe]

first off, let me say that I agree that there are bad drivers. And I think that there are times to use the phone and times not to use the phone. I also believe that a bluetooth headset, if used properly, can be safer than a hand held.

But, lets say that you, being a good driver, are driving down the road and during a safe time are using your hand held phone. During this time, you are using one hand to steer or maybe even, as my wife does, steering with your knees. You most likely are not concentrating as hard on driving and focusing a little more on the conversation at hand. Suddenly, a crazy driver flies up behind you, and as their car passes you, they begin to lose control. Their car veers hard, and is destined to ram the rear side of your car.

You have a split second to decide. Should I speed up, slam on the brakes, turn left, turn right, drop the phone, hold the phone, use one hand, use two hands.
Too Late, the car rams you. Your car is going 65 mph down the highway (if you are a "good" driver) and is spinning out of control.

Can you honestly say that you would be able to maneuver just as well with a hand held at that particular moment?

For me, I would have to say no. I consider myself to be a great driver. And I would consider it to be okay to use the phone during safe times of driving. But, I do think that there are people out there, that could cause a situation, I would not be able to handle while using a hand held phone.

As far as, making it a law.... I don't know. Personally, I am totally against government stepping in and running our lives.
But, I do think it would make things safer.

[slosurfer]

Yeah, maybe you can add a few more options to the vote or explain it better. Is this for a full cell phone ban (including hands free) or is this just a ban on handhelds?

I'm all for banning handhelds and texting while driving, and I believe you already can get pulled over for other things like shaving, reading, etc... if they see you and consider it a threat to others safety.

Banning hands free is just rediculous! :shake:

[made in canada]

Here in nova scotia they are banned and have been for a while, and the next town over from me has banned smoking, yes that means in your rig too, I talk on my cell all the time, and normally have a cigar if driving for a while, i have never got a ticket, you just have to keep your eyes open for cops.

If you are a "good" driver, you are always aware of your surroundings, so therefore you should never get caught doing them bad things.

[4runnerchevy]

Without a doubt ban cells and text, while driving. Those that don't comply, need a shot to the head. Without reading any posts, its an easy one. Die f$ckers, who use them on the road ! In my own opinion, and no further discussion needed.

[Tankota]

Yes - I support the ban on texting and handheld use while driving, but not for head sets. Thats taking it a little too far.

Talking on the phone makes good drivers bad drivers, and makes bad drivers worse drivers.
From your first post Oly.



Cell phones don't make people bad drivers, they were already bad drivers. The cell phone is not what caused the accident, the driver did.


I dont believe anyone thinks that the cell phone caused the accident. It was the driver, (who normally pays attention) who was talking on his phone, got distracted for a second, and merged without looking over his shoulder.
I dont know howmany times its happened to me. 18yo blond girl driving daddy's BMW chattering to her boyfriend and not paying any attention to the road. Sure without the phone she will still be a bad driver, but having the phone in her hand makes things even worse.

I have even scared myself bad a couple times while driving and talking on the phone. Nearly rear ended some idiot merging onto the freeway and doing 35mph. Now even though I was driving properly and they were driving very dangerously, it was my concentration that was compromised by my phone activity.

Needless to say, really try not to use my phone unless I really have to, and even then only for very short times.

I have a little game I play by my self when I'm driving behind someone going really slow and not staying in their lane. I try to guess if they're talking on the phone before I actually see the driver. Most of the time they are on the phone.

You say responsible drivers will know when not to awnser their phones, but what about the majority who pickup every time the stupid thing rings. Having a law for them to follow gives them a good reason not to pickup or call sombody.





This law is removing blame from people. You hit someone on a bike while talking on your cell phone, then you pay the price as you were clearly being reckless. You rear end someone because you were on a cell phone, then you are to blame because you were not paying attention. It's REALLY that simple folks. If people were pulled over for driving like idiots more, due to cell phones or not due to cell phones, then the message would get out that "DON'T DRIVE LIKE AN IDIOT."


exactly!


The law doesnt remove blame from someone that caused and accident while on the phone. :headscratch: They will have the same penalty as someone who caused and accident while not on the phone.



Is it the gun that decides to murder someone? Is it the car that runs the red light? Is it the alcohol that magically goes into someone's stomach? Do I really need to continue?


Are you also apposed to laws that outlaw running red lights. Should we not have DUI laws, because a good responsible driver wont get into his car while drunk? Should we not have cellphone laws because good responsible drivers wont talk while in bad driving conditions. What about all the non-good-responsible people out there.

The cell phone laws are in effect because the vast majority of drivers get distracted and do not react quickly when on the phone.






In know I jumped on some of you arguments Oly, but please dont taken anything personally, these are just my opinyons and observations. just trying to stir some debate here. :D

[Nuthuts96]

I have a little game I play by my self when I'm driving behind someone going really slow and not staying in their lane. I try to guess if they're talking on the phone before I actually see the driver. Most of the time they are on the phone.


Is that the ONLY game you play by yourself? :angel:

Seriously, though, I play that game, too...I also try and guess the perp's description. their sex and age come to mind right now. i'm about 80% on guessing correctly- just ask my wife!

I'm pretty sure the person I rear ended in my bus on I-90 was on a phone and declined to do a simple blind spot check... gave me about 2 seconds to SLAM on my brakes as she changed lanes and it still wasn't enough... let's just say that a phone caused "negligence in the 2nd degree"- oh, and the $350 fine on TOP of the crushed trunk probably did NOTHING in keeping her from doing this again!

the bus= estimated at $2.50 touch up paint
the car= estimated (by trooper on scene) at $4000.

moral of the story, DON'T CUT A BUS OFF!
/rant

stupid people cause laws into existence. if we were all perfect, we wouldn't need "pointers" (laws) to steer us in the right direction.

[fustercluck]

I think thr true measure of personal freedom can only be realized through personal responsibility. If we are to be free men, then we must be equally reponsible. In this case, the individual who is distracted, must endure the consequences himself. If he moves to deflect responsibility or place it on others, then we all lose freedom. This is what we've done. As a society we have conditioned the individual to avoid consequences by placing responsibility on the least capable of objecting. We have removed consequence from behavior so the individual fails to learn and modify behavior of his own free will. Now central power must impose it. Since central power is incapable of distinguishing one individual's responsibility from another's, all must be compelled to conform and limit behavior. All have lost freedom. Do this cycle enough and all will find themselves in bondage and oppression one day.

Let this be a lesson. When we allow central power to consider freedoms as priviledges, then those freedoms can be manipulated and removed; regardless of personal responsibility.

[habanero]

Yeah, I figured that'd be the response but please tell me I didn't just see posts inferring that I should ride my bike on the sidewalk??? Sure, you can't ride on the interstate, but highways and roads, yes you can. I can't go 3 miles in any direction from my home without being on a highway, and in two directions it's a block. I ride on the roads and while I'm not particularly safe there, pedestrians are safe from me. Running a 20 mile an hour average only belongs on the road. It's the law around here and I follow the rules of the road while I'm on the bike. Those in a car should be considerate and do likewise. By the bye, I use the bike for everything including recreation, commuting, getting the kid to school, shopping, going to the library, etc etc. Even if it weren't against the law to ride on the sidewalk there is no continuous sidewalk where I live, no sidewalk on my street at all.
Urgh!!!

Ok, back to your cell phone fest.
The problem with thinking that the cell phone idiot that causes an accident pays it that they aren't the only one who does, just the only one who deserves but doesn't always get the biggest bill, especially when it was someone elses' life.
Hands free, I might would be less inclined to worry about. Haven't given it a ton of thought. I've not got one of those. I've found it takes more attention to hold a conversation on the phone than it does to listen to the radio, but that's just me, or is it? As for bad drivers I'm sure every one of us here is absolutely the best driver on the road. If we were bad drivers even a little bit we'd know it, surely? :flipoff:

[CJM]

Hab, people like you who can share the road with cars are good.

In my area the illegals drive down the middle of the road and WONT move over for you. Thats what I hate, the cops just stopped caring about anything happening to them too, kinda funny in a way.

[oly884]

Tankota, no worries, nothing taken personal here! You make some great points, and I'll site what you said:


I have even scared myself bad a couple times while driving and talking on the phone. Nearly rear ended some idiot merging onto the freeway and doing 35mph. Now even though I was driving properly and they were driving very dangerously, it was my concentration that was compromised by my phone activity.

Needless to say, really try not to use my phone unless I really have to, and even then only for very short times.

You and I are much alike, I do not talk on the cell phone much when I am driving, and when I do, it's short and to the point. But once again, this is addressing a issue of driver distraction and irresponsibility, that's a bigger issue. From what I have heard, it is a 100% ban on cell phones, hands or no hands. So if that's the case, why just target cell phones, there are so many other things in cars that can distract a driver. How many people have you seen toying with their GPS system while driving?

Hab, by no means am I implying that road bikers should not be on the road. I can tell by your personality that you are a good rider and have respect for the road. The term "share the road" goes out a lot, and I'm 100% for that, but "share" goes both ways. Drivers and bicyclists are much the same, there are the ones who respect eachother, and there are ones that don't. I know you're not one of them.

And Hab, you also bring up a great point. The idiot on the cell phone is usually not the only one who pays. We all share the road, and when someone does something stupid, there is usually other people who pay the price. It's very sad, and it irritates me to no end that a person could be so negligent.

What would you folks think about increasing the fine if the driver was found to be negligent/distracted? Increase the penalty for ANY distraction that causes an accident? Run a national campaign ad that states if you are in an accident and you were found to be distracted (cell phone, food, etc) you will get a nice fat $500 ticket on the spot, I bet that would curb some cell phone use.

I'll say this to sum up all my points (I'm a nerd and think about this stuff a lot):

The cell phone ban is addressing a larger issue, driver distraction, if you're going to come down on cell phones then you need to come down on many other distractions including eating, drinking, GPS devices, rocking out to good music, smoking, or reading directions on a map/paper. The other option I see is to increase the penalty if the driver commits a misdemeanor/crime while being distracted by any of these things, slap a $100, $200, or $500 ticket on top of a failure to yield or changing lanes without a blinker. I am for the latter of the two cases from the standpoint that while distractions can be dangerous, a good driver has the proper judgment to know when it's ok to take a sip of soda, eat a sandwich, or place a call.

[Tankota]

And Hab, you also bring up a great point. The idiot on the cell phone is usually not the only one who pays. We all share the road, and when someone does something stupid, there is usually other people who pay the price. It's very sad, and it irritates me to no end that a person could be so negligent.



This is one reason that I support a ban on handheld use while driving. NO fine or imprisonment is going to erase the hurt of a loved one getting killed or hurt by a driver distracted and on the phone. This law has been the only thing so far to reduce cell phone use on the roads.

Since the majority of the driving population has shown complete irresponsibility and lack of judgment, this right is being removed from them. Not so much for their own protection, but for the protection of others around them.

Yes many times I have seen people distracted by GPS units, or screaming kids. But I think cellphones are by far the biggest and most commonplace driver distraction. For me, talking on the phone takes much more concentration than say eating or listening to music. Yes there will be accidents caused by both of those, but never to the extent of cell phones.


I am very opposed to government managing our lives and imposing regulations to control our every move... But for this matter of common public safety, I do support this one.

[Tankota]

I have a little game I play by my self when I'm driving behind someone going really slow and not staying in their lane. I try to guess if they're talking on the phone before I actually see the driver. Most of the time they are on the phone.


Is that the ONLY game you play by yourself? :angel:



While driving it is, hehe. :loser:

I KNEW someone was going to say something about that, hehe! :chair:

[Nuthuts96]

It was a perfect setup! all credit to you, my friend.


This is one reason that I support a ban on handheld use while driving. NO fine or imprisonment is going to erase the hurt of a loved one getting killed or hurt by a driver distracted and on the phone. This law has been the only thing so far to reduce cell phone use on the roads.

Since the majority of the driving population has shown complete irresponsibility and lack of judgment, this right is being removed from them. Not so much for their own protection, but for the protection of others around them.

Yes many times I have seen people distracted by GPS units, or screaming kids. But I think cellphones are by far the biggest and most commonplace driver distraction. For me, talking on the phone takes much more concentration than say eating or listening to music. Yes there will be accidents caused by both of those, but never to the extent of cell phones.


I am very opposed to government managing our lives and imposing regulations to control our every move... But for this matter of common public safety, I do support this one.

100% agree!