New Project: Push Button M-Series Light Switch

[slosurfer]

I'm always a sucker for military gadgets, especially useful ones that can be used for camping, wheeling, my trailer, etc..., so I when one of the new Push Button M-Series Light Switch (http://www.olive-drab.com/od_mseries_lightswitch_pushbutton.php3) popped up on Pirate, I had to snag it. I plan on putting all my aux lighting and future lighting on this switch.

The switch and the one it replaced (also the one I was used to from when I was in the Marines):

http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e113/slosurfer27/4runner/Military%20Switch/push_button_lightswitch_2.jpg

A couple pics of how they look lit up. Pics courtesy of Wolf359's build on Pirate

Push any button to get the whole panel to light up:
http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e113/slosurfer27/4runner/Military%20Switch/Image-7D67F19512D111DA.jpg

Push the button you want and then press enter and that selection will light up blue:
http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e113/slosurfer27/4runner/Military%20Switch/Image-7D5F4B9912D111DA.jpg

You can turn all the selections on and off independantly or you can hit "All Off" and then "Enter" to turn them all off. With 7 selections, I should be good for my lighting switches, plus more.

I still need to source the connector that plugs in the back. Wolf359 was able to get the connector with pigtail from a company, so I'm going to try to do that. He got it from http://randesales.com/ **Edit- I never did hear back after multiple emails to randesales.com but I was able to get it at www.tnjmurray.com :thumbup:

Not sure where it will mount or anything yet, but I was too stoked to not share. :D

[DHC6twinotter]

Oh wow...that is nice! :thumbup:

[RunnerUp]

very nice... i want it
\

[slosurfer]

;) Thanks guys! I was pretty stoked to snag it. Yay, xmas $$. :laugh:


There aren't too many places to fit something like this on a 2nd gen, so I'm thinking this might be a good spot. Relocate the elocker switch (possibly to the center console), relocate the dimmer, and the other switch will be going on this switch so that one doesn't matter. I'm also thinking of relocating the rock lights master control somewhere else. then the dimmer and elocker could go there.

http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e113/slosurfer27/4runner/Military%20Switch/IMG_8355.jpg

http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e113/slosurfer27/4runner/Military%20Switch/IMG_8356.jpg

[Seanz0rz]

chris, do you ever use your dimmer? just stuff it back in the dash somewhere!

[slosurfer]

chris, do you ever use your dimmer? just stuff it back in the dash somewhere!


That's a good idea! The only time I use it, is when I hit it with my knee, and have to turn it back down. :thumbup:

[4x4mike]

Relocate the elocker switch (possibly to the center console), relocate the dimmer, and the other switch will be going on this switch so that one doesn't matter. I'm also thinking of relocating the rock lights master control somewhere else. then the dimmer and elocker could go there.


Can't you wire those to this panel? I would do it just because they're all in one place.

What material are the buttons? Rubber? Plastic?
It would be cool if you could pop them out and have them relabeled.

[slosurfer]

I will be wiring the one light switch to the panel for sure.

The dimmer knob I don't want to wire to the panel as that would be a PITA to make it work right. (going to a push button rheostat) when I can easily move it or stash it somewhere.

The elocker switch is up in the air. I can wire it to the panel as long as it will only turn to blue once the locker is engaged (not just when I turn it on). The switch I have now has a blue led on it and it only turns on if the locker is engaged (if the locker won't engage for some reason, it won't light up, thus letting me know something's up). My only other hang up is if I want to use the "All Off" function, as it would be cool to douse all the lights at once, but not neccesarily the locker. For example, this past weekend, I had the rear locker engaged for most of the time around camp.

I will wire the rock lights through the switch as I want to hardwire them anyways. Then I will have to hit this switch before I turn them on. I will still need to put the mastercontrol somewhere. It can be hidden as I can operate it all through the remote if need be. I may see about putting it up by my map lights. I kind of like this anyways, as I can still manually control it, but it's not as obvious sitting where it's at now.

The buttons are rubber like. I can take the switch apart, but it would be hard to just relabel them. The button is black, except for the white lettering, and the clear round area where the indicator light shines through. Almost would have to make a new button. Maybe I'll get brave and pull it apart. :laugh:

[troyboy162]

thats friggen awesome! those switches are nice. few of our lmtv's had them and i thought they were way to nice for us lol

[slosurfer]

haha, I know, I would have crapped myself if they gave me one of those for my AAV. The other ones were a pain though, you had to memorize the switch to work it in the dark. WE always had boots driving who would accidently turn it the wrong way and turn the headlights on rather than the B.O. markers. :shake: We always just removed our headlights so that it would never happen.

[Bob98SR5]

chris,

did some p-chopping for you. i didnt touch or resize anything, so it appears that it might be too big for your console spot. see attached pic

[Erich_870]

Very cool!

About how much does that switch run? Just wondering :)

Erich

[slosurfer]

Thanks Bob, that does look pretty tight. I also have to make sure I have the clearance behind as well. Time to break out the tape measure. :D

Erich, I paid $75 shipped for it. :thumbup: There is at least one on Ebay right now for slightly more. You may even be able to find it at some online military surplus stores.

Considering, my elocker switch with guard and my Carling DPDT switch for my lights came to almost $50, this is a great deal. It can take the place of at least 7 switches.

[Erich_870]

Erich, I paid $75 shipped for it. :thumbup: There is at least one on Ebay right now for slightly more. You may even be able to find it at some online military surplus stores.

Considering, my elocker switch with guard and my Carling DPDT switch for my lights came to almost $50, this is a great deal. It can take the place of at least 7 switches.


No disagreement here, $75 is a great deal for all the features and coolness factor! :hillbill: I also think it's awesome that you had to use the older version in your military service, and now you can upgrade your personal rig with the new hotness :thumbup:

I've always wanted to build a 4Runner into my version of a military vehicle, with all the placards, labels and the OD green. :love:

Erich

[slosurfer]

I've always wanted to build a 4Runner into my version of a military vehicle, with all the placards, labels and the OD green. :love:

Erich


Haha, I know what you mean. If I had the time and money, I'd be doing that to the van with a set of portal axles. And I'd call it MiniPinz.



chris,

did some p-chopping for you. i didnt touch or resize anything, so it appears that it might be too big for your console spot. see attached pic


Bob, I just went and measured it. I must have had the switch held slightly closer to the camera in the pic you used to pshop it. The whole switch (rectangle part, not just the oval that shows through) is just under 2.75"x3.75". I have a good 4 1/8" from top to bottom to play with and plenty of side to side. As long as I have the room behind the panel, I'll be good. It will need some kind of plate to go on first to cover up the factory cutouts and the hole where the dimmer knob is. Then it should look nice and clean with just the oval sticking out. My dad has sheets of brass that I could use, I could then paint it, or have it plated in brushed nickel or something. Thanks for the pshop, I can't wait to make it a reality. :thumbup:

[slosurfer]

I'm thinking of moving the elocker switch to where MarcP has his. Although mine will just be replacing the spot where it has a tiny coin pocket that fits a switch blank, since mine isn't a panel and only a switch.

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b251/MarcP1971/e-lock025.jpg

[slosurfer]

I've sent out a few parts requests to different places for the wire connector with a pigtail of wires. Hopefully, I'll hear something this weekend or Monday. I just hope that part doesn't cost more than the switch. :laugh: Once, I have that, I can start on the project.

On a hummerH1 online store, I found where they are selling this switch for almost $500! :yikes:

[slosurfer]

I finally was able to find this darn plug and it should be on its way to me today. :drink:

I emailed a bunch of companies to see about getting this plug and was dissapointed in the number of responces I got back. I probably emailed about 10+ companies and only heard back from 4.
1. 100dollarman on pirate got back to me right away but didn't have anything like that (he's more into building military trucks to sell, not really into parts, so it didn't surprise me, but was worth a shot)
2. one company only sold to the gov't or gov't contractors (not really sure why they needed a nice public website though to get my hopes up, but they at least got back to me and let me know they couldn't sell to me)
3. http://www.tnjmurray.com/ Got back to me right away and I ordered a good take off plug for $25 (not sure what shipping will be)
4. www.muttparts.com also got back to me right away but just a couple hours later and I had already ordered from tnjmurray. Their's was slightly less and would have been ~$28 with shipping.

Anyways, just wanted to give props to those companies that responded back. I'll probably add their websites over on my m416 build thread. :thumbup:

I can't wait to get this. I need a project since work is slow. :(

[slosurfer]

Got my connector today from TNJ Murray (http://www.tnjmurray.com/). woohoo! Now I can get started on my project. :hillbill: It came to $37 with shipping. Even though it is a "takeoff" the actual plug looks brand new.

http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e113/slosurfer27/4runner/Military%20Switch/IMG_8381.jpg

http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e113/slosurfer27/4runner/Military%20Switch/IMG_8382.jpg

[slosurfer]

Okay, I've got a question for the wireing gurus.

Here's a chart of the pins and where they would normally go on a military vehicle. I got it from here. (http://www.olive-drab.com/od_mseries_lightswitch.php3)

http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e113/slosurfer27/4runner/Military%20Switch/MLightswitch.jpg

My question concerns connector pins A and K. I'm planning on probably using that switch for aux lights (not sure which ones yet), so do both pins have to be wired to the relay on that set of lights for the switch to work right? If so, how would I do that? :headscratch:

[corax]

Pin A: Stop Lamp Switch. Runs through brake light switch to Pin K.
Pin K: Stop Lamp Switch. Runs from pin A through brake light switch.
Pin C: Stop Lights. Hot when brakes applied. Runs to turn signal switch if used.

In my experience the brake light switch makes contact (closed circuit / continuity) when you step on the pedal, allowing current to flow to the lights and turn them on. I would guess that A and K just get tied together (continuity, as if the pedal was being stepped on to allow current to flow) that being said, you should probably stick a 7.5 or 5 amp fuse on that wire just to make sure nothing gets too hot when you test it.

Just a guess, but the circuit (from positive to "load" or ground) goes from A to the nonexistant brake switch (or wires tied together) back to K and then comes out of the switch again on pin C (+ voltage to brake lights) which doesn't make sense to me because if they want the ability to kill the lights it could just go from A to the switch to the lights and they could kill it before it even leaves your fancy switch.

I'd really need to see what the switch's internal circuit diagram looks like to say anything for sure (or spend some quality time with an ohm-meter). If you can find a link to the Humvee wiring diagram, that might help - it would also tell me it the switch controls everything on the ground side or by supplying voltage (big diff)

One other oddity, from the pinout you posted, where does it get power from?

[slosurfer]

I think I'm following what you're saying Keith. I'll find some more diagrams and info tonight.

Also, I believe the switch gets its power from pin F Battery Power Lead. The switch itself has the ground wire.

[slosurfer]

Okay, I think I figured it out. HEre's a list of the "circuits"
http://www.olive-drab.com/od_mseries_circuits.php3

Just look up the circuit for each pin. So we're looking at 22 and 75 circuits. After rereading it, I can just use pin C since pin A and K go to the stop switch which is actually for your turn signals. So I can just leave A and K alone for right now.

[slosurfer]

Okay here's a wiring diagram. I'll try to snag it and post it but here's the link:
http://m37.crwdesigns.com/m37wiring.jpg

Look at the Light Control Switch near the center of the diagram.
So it looks like A and K just loop with a stop switch to make/break continuity, and then C goes to Turn Signal Relay. Not sure what those symbols on A and K are, are they fuses?

Edit: I looked at the legend and those are just single wire connectors.

So I'm guessing I need to loop A and K and run C to whatever relay I chose to run with that switch, correct?

[corax]

Look at the Light Control Switch near the center of the diagram.
So it looks like A and K just loop with a stop switch to make/break continuity, and then C goes to Turn Signal Relay.
So I'm guessing I need to loop A and K and run C to whatever relay I chose to run with that switch, correct?


Yep, that's what I was thinking.

Also, looking at the wiring diagram, it would appear the switch does control everything on the positive side (turns things on by supplying voltage, not by giving a ground). So relay wiring should be pretty simple - wire from your switch to the relay coil / other side of relay coil to ground.

[slosurfer]

Look at the Light Control Switch near the center of the diagram.
So it looks like A and K just loop with a stop switch to make/break continuity, and then C goes to Turn Signal Relay.
So I'm guessing I need to loop A and K and run C to whatever relay I chose to run with that switch, correct?


Yep, that's what I was thinking.

Also, looking at the wiring diagram, it would appear the switch does control everything on the positive side (turns things on by supplying voltage, not by giving a ground). So relay wiring should be pretty simple - wire from your switch to the relay coil / other side of relay coil to ground.


Thanks Keith! :thumbup:

[Rock Slide]

Chris, any updates on this? Curious to see how it turned out. :D

[slosurfer]

Sorry, no updates, I put it on hold for a bit because I thought I was getting a roll cage. I needed to make sure it would fit with the roll cage bar coming down right there.

Funds got short, so no roll cage for awhile, so I'll get on this pretty soon. I'll just have to keep it as far inboard as I can to leave room for a roll cage down the road.

[Crinale]

Can always run the rollcage into the dash, iv seen other trucks do it this way... follow the A pillar all the way into the dash. That way the bar will be behind the switch, and no risk of hitting your knees on the bar gettin into the truck ^_^

[slosurfer]

Yeah, there's always that way. :) I actually had my eye on one that was already built. :hillbill:

[slosurfer]

Okay, so I may be doing this project soon. My alarm is on the way and I want to clean up a lot of my wiring when I do the alarm, so it might be the perfect time to get this wired in.

I have never soldered wiring before, does anyone have a good "how to" site about it. I'm thinking I want to learn and do this right. :thumbup:

[Seanz0rz]

heh, i can show you my way of doing it, if you can wait till monday when i actually have a soldering iron handy.

basically, strip 1/2 -3/4 inch off each wire, put in line with eachother (end of one insulation to end of the other, with the wires overlapping in the middle) and twist tightly, then solder. cover with heatshrink tubing.

as for how to solder, this guide is not bad: http://www.allsands.com/howto/howtosolder_cc_gn.htm

soldering larger wire is very difficult, and ive only had marginal success on anything larger than 16. google has tons of results for "how to solder", id read up as much as you can. basically, you want to get the wire hot and then melt the solder into it. i use a 30W soldering iron, and ive found the guns to be too cumbersome to use most of the time.

[Seanz0rz]

actually, looking at that link, its more for PCB mount soldering. both google and youtube have extensive how to material on the subject

[slosurfer]

Thanks Sean! so it's pretty much like when I solder brass pieces together to make drawer pulls at my dad's shop, you have to heat the material (in this case, wires) up enough to melt the solder?

I'll google around some with it. :)

[Seanz0rz]

I'll put together a short "here's what you need to know" how to next week if I find time.

[slosurfer]

Cool sean! :thumbup:

What I plan on doing is soldering bullet connectors to the pigtail of wires coming off the plug. I'll probably have to add to some of the wires first so that all the connections are staggered. I would love to do it with the military bullet connectors with the big rubber boots, but all the one's I've seen are really expensive.

[Seanz0rz]

http://www.allelectronics.com/ might have them cheaper. they are typically about 1/4 the price of retail outlets like autozone, radioshack, etc. and have alot more selection. also look on ebay. you might have to buy 50, but they will be the same price as buying 8 at the store.

[reggie 00]

Cool sean! :thumbup:

What I plan on doing is soldering bullet connectors to the pigtail of wires coming off the plug. I'll probably have to add to some of the wires first so that all the connections are staggered. I would love to do it with the military bullet connectors with the big rubber boots, but all the one's I've seen are really expensive.


I think the proper name is cannon plugs?
I have put a few together. the pins are crimped onto the wires. Not soldered.

[slosurfer]

I think the proper name is cannon plugs?
I have put a few together. the pins are crimped onto the wires. Not soldered.


Reggie, the big plug pictured here is the cannon plug and it has a pigtail of wires. I'm going to put bullet connectors on the ends of those wires and still use the cannon plug. It will make wiring to the switch much easier. The military has these nice bullet connectors that have big rubber boots on them, but they are expensive, I'll probably just solder on regular bullet connectors.

Cannon plug
http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e113/slosurfer27/4runner/Military%20Switch/IMG_8381.jpg

Military bullet connectors
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/WATER-PROOF-CONNECTORS-M998-M35-M151-M38-M715-M37-M54_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trkparmsZalgoQ3dSIQ26itsQ3d IQ252BCQ26ituQ3dFICSQ252BUAQ252BUCIQ26otnQ3d15Q26p oQ3dLVIQ26psQ3d54QQ_trksidZp3907Q2em263QQcategoryZ 10076QQitemZ330329108339

[Crinale]

doesnt look too bad price wise if you can win that auction near the starting bid... as long as it doesnt get up to the $50 buy it now price... lol

[slosurfer]

doesnt look too bad price wise if you can win that auction near the starting bid... as long as it doesnt get up to the $50 buy it now price... lol


:laugh: NO Kidding! I got excited about them at first, when I saw the low price, then I looked at the buy it now price. :( I really don't have the need for them, so I'll just use regular bullet connectors. The mil spec ones really would be overkill for something that is just under the dash.

If I were to build a open rockcrawler, I would definately consider doing it all mil spec.

[reggie 00]

ah i see now said the blind man as he picked up his hammer and saw.


I agree those connectors would be a bit over kill.

If you wanted something easy and weather proof, wouldn't some simple blue bullet connectors and some silicone and heat shrink tubing work?

[slosurfer]

Yeah reggie, those will work great. That's what I have connecting my four flat towing plug to my m416 trailer harness. They will plug right into the mil spec ones.

The only reason I'm considering soldering the bullet connectors on and then do the shrinkwrap, instead of crimped bullet connectors, is A)for the challenge and to learn something new and B) there area a lot of wires right there in that bundle and the crimped connectors might make it too unruly. :) (although it might not be that bad, LOL)

[reggie 00]

Soldering connectors is pretty easy.

Heat up the solder and fill the connector, while its still hot insert the wire. Let cool done. Get a little pin torch. Just don't catch your self on fire.

That's how you would do say an 0 gauge wire battery terminal.

[slosurfer]

:laugh: Yeah, I found a youtube vid of how to do it and was like "damn that's easy" Plus I get to go get another tool, since I don't have a solder gun :hillbill:

[slosurfer]

Starting to rethink where I'm going to mount this switch. :laugh:

Here's where I'm thinking of mounting it.
Beware this isn't a true mockup, just seeing if it even fits there with what I was thinking.
http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e113/slosurfer27/4runner/Military%20Switch/IMG_9855.jpg

ignore the switch being upside down
http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e113/slosurfer27/4runner/Military%20Switch/IMG_9854.jpg

Basically I will build something that will extend my center console and replace the area that is above the little cubby hole before the switches in front of the shifters. I will have to pull the console to make a proper mock up, but it will be angled slightly more downward and I want to make the top part hinged (basically where the duct tape is), so that it will make it easy to access the wireing when needed. Also, it would make a good spot to add another 12v plug.

Couple reasons for wanting to put it there.
1. I can keep my elocker and winch controls up on the dash and out of the way from accidentally getting turned on.

2. This switch and the plug on the back of it, need a deep space to fit, and I don't think it would have fit where I wanted it to. The only other place would have been on the dash on the passenger side, which I would have no problem reaching but would have looked odd.

I may also take that gaudy looking control panel for the rock lights and stash it inside this box and hardwire it to the switch. Then I can turn it on and off with the switch and then I will just use the remote if I want to use the other play functions and the control panel will be hidden out of view. :)


I sat in there and moved the shifters around like I was driving and with it angled down a little more, it was totally out of the way. Only thing is, I'll be loseing that little cubby, but all that ever sits there is pennies, trash, and keys. :laugh:

[4x4mike]

Cool. I like my switches in or on the console because it's easy routing to the front, rear and bottom of the vehicle. You've got on mondo switch and the rear plug in is pretty burly.

[slosurfer]

I was totally thinking of how you were saying that you ran your wires when I was thinking of putting the switch there. :laugh: If I can make it how I picture it, I'm hoping the flip up lid will make it easy to work with. I'm thinking of hitting up a jyard to see if I can find one of these center consoles to use for mock ups. It's hard to do the mock up on it while it's in the vehicle, the 2nd gens are tight in there, but it would be sweet to have one to mock up on a bench and then move the mock up to the 4runner to see if it fits.

I'm also considering extending all the wires on the switch plug (even the ones that won't be used right away) and running them up to under the dash somewhere. That way it will be really easy to add accessories to the switch.

Another thought/dream would be to move the switch over more passenger side and install a switch on the front of the box and one of these Rail Shifters (http://radesignsproducts.com/default.aspx), so I could switch it and manually control the transmission shifts. Of course that's just a dream. :laugh: One of the baja shifters would be cool, but there's no room for one of those unless I totally redid the console and removed the rear heater in it.

[corax]

If I can make it how I picture it, I'm hoping the flip up lid will make it easy to work with. I'm thinking of hitting up a jyard to see if I can find one of these center consoles to use for mock ups. It's hard to do the mock up on it while it's in the vehicle, the 2nd gens are tight in there, but it would be sweet to have one to mock up on a bench and then move the mock up to the 4runner to see if it fits. . . .
. . . . Another thought/dream would be to move the switch over more passenger side and install a switch on the front of the box and one of these Rail Shifters (http://radesignsproducts.com/default.aspx), so I could switch it and manually control the transmission shifts. Of course that's just a dream. :laugh: One of the baja shifters would be cool, but there's no room for one of those unless I totally redid the console and removed the rear heater in it.


how about a custom job like this one? It's not as hard as it looks (thin plywood, felt/that unused Snuggy you have laying around, fiberglass resin, sand paper)
http://i274.photobucket.com/albums/jj277/TheQDog/100_0100.jpg
thread link from that other forum (http://www.yotatech.com/f115/custom-cb-ipod-console-shifter-boot-upgrade-139770/)

although this is one of my favorites
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y136/4rnr/centerconsole008.jpg
yet another thread link from that other site (http://www.yotatech.com/f88/my-home-built-center-console-137626/)

[slosurfer]

Kevin, that first one you posted is awesome! I kind of want to make something right now, I'm pretty sure I already have a bunch of fiberglass and resin left over from fixing my surfboard (split the nose in half lengthwise :laugh: )

I don't think I'm ready to do a whole center console yet, but that technique would be cool to even use for adding on to the existing console.

4rnr's set up is really cool too. I can see having to go that route if I ever do an engine swap or go to duals. He actually had (got rid of it when he went to a 3.4) a similar shifting setup like I want to get, except his was with up/down buttons rather than a rail shifter. You really open up a lot more space for adding stuff when you raise the whole thing up like he did. I'm not sure how hard it would be to raise the whole stock shifting assembly up that high as I know with the auto 3.0 it's hard to do a big body lift because of the shift cables not having much lenght adjustment in them.

[Crinale]

fairly easy solution though... only lift the very front part of the console like 3 inches, and step it up the further back you get...

[slosurfer]

fairly easy solution though... only lift the very front part of the console like 3 inches, and step it up the further back you get...


Yeah, that's true, you could also move the shifters back just a tad too to gain some more height, but for the work, it's not worth it. You don't gain much by raising the front 3 inches (unless you are adding more shifters) :hillbill:.

I think I'm going to shop around for someone parting out a 2nd gen that has the rear heat and see if I can snag that center console to build this off of.

[Crinale]

im seriously debating building my own... the stock console is nearly useless in the 2nd gen...