Rear tire carrier build

[Lee]

OK, this is my goal:

http://www.toyotacrawlers.com/tirecarrierchop3.jpg

so far I have the hinge which i got off rocklogic
http://www.rocklogic4x4.com/store/images/products/spindle.jpg

im picking up a latch from grainger with a 2000 pound capacity.

i also got a bracket for my lic plate and i trying to get a hold of a DOT approved led lic plate lamp :gay: :hillbill:

i am looking to replicate Darren's carrier:
http://www.mycolorado.org/images/4runnin/images/camp3.jpg

which basically will be 2 main bars and a stantion bracket.

SO.... anyone who's done this, any tips, tricks, ideas, etc?

I am open to all opinions. Right now my plan is to hinge it on the right, and center the tire on the bumper.

[bamachem]

hinge on the right and center the tire for sure.

you'll need some HDPE or rubber as a cushion to latch the main beam down onto the bumper against.

i used the license plate bracket and light from a 90/91 2nd gen that had the OEM tire carrier.

use 1/4" thick tube, and at least 2" of vertical height. i would recommend 2"x3"x1/4" carrier beam (oriented so that it's 2" wide and 3" tall) and a 2"x2"x1/4" riser. this will reduce flex considerably.

don't forget to brace the bumper along the inside back to the frame mounting bracket as well. 1/4" leftovers work fine for that.

[Lee]

good info, thanks andy :thumbup:

my plan was to use 2x2 or 2x3 for the main bar, 2x2 for the "riser" as you called it then a 1x1 stantion.

thanks again.

[Robinhood4x4]

Hinge on the left and put the tire as far to the left as possible. :flipoff: Andy.

My tool box is on the left side so that I can still see cars that are behind and to the right of me. I can't see out the left side of the rear window anyway so for the greatest visibility I put it on the left. The argument for putting the hinge on the right is if the carrier should open accidentally, you won't hit cars on your left. But my argument is you'll hit pedestrians on your right. Pick your poison.

Whatever you do, you want your weight as close to the hinge as possible...less stress on everything.

Design it so that when closed, the side opposite the hinge will carry 50% of the load. Less stress on the hinge that way. The latch side of mine needs to be lifted about an inch or two before it will clear and close.

Ideally, the latching mechanism will be designed so that the carrier is touching at three points to prevent vibration. This is hard to do unless you start building the latch upwards.

[Lee]

i am thinking of devising a pin system as a "backup" to the hinge as well.

Thanks for the pointers man :)

[Bighead]

My honest opinion...don't do it. I had the twin to Darren's bumper (made at the same time) and ran it for several years. Getting rid of it was one of the best "mods" I've done to my 4Runner. The Rockware design is pretty good but the one issue that kept popping up was carrier vibration.

So since you are going to do it anyway ( ;) ) just watch the clearance between the bumper and any body panels. The vibration from my old Rockware induced by flexing or hitting washboard roads and potholes, caused a part of the bumper to rub a divot into the sides of my rear hatch.

Now my spare 315 rides tucked up in the stock spare location with a new crossmember (taller to take advantage of my 1.5" BL) made by Schaefer. Now it's tucked out of the way and no longer limits my rear visibility.

[Lee]

what was the rockware bumper made of? currently my bumper doesnt budge no matter how hard i hit it. it also clears the body panels very well.

its made out of 3/16ths too so im not too worried.

if you can get me the info on the rockware bumper id appreciate it.. thanks lance.

[Seanz0rz]

my solution, when i finally get around to this someday, is to put a vertical riser off the rear bumper up the left side of the vehicle, much like the 90 and 91 spare tire carriers.

only worry is that it obstructs the taillight, and ive yet to come up with a solution, but maybe this is a starting point for you.

[bamachem]

[the frame is what gives - not the bumper]

the only way to fix that is to plate the frame and put some reinforcing struts (in an X pattern) where your current spare tire bracket is located.

[Lee]

i was under the impression he was saying the bumper is what flexed ??

i have 2 new crossmembers on the back of my frame, i wonder if thats enough.

i guess i could remove one and make an X instead.

[bamachem]

that will probably be OK the way you have it.

i will be pulling mine off when time allows and plating the frame, then cutting out the stock crossmember and building one from 3/16" tubing to brace it side to side. hell, if i get tired of it like everyone else who's had them, then i'll just lop off the carrier, seal up where the hinge used to live and clean things up, etc, and then just get schaefer to build a new crossmember and carry it underneath. i had hoped to put an aux gas tank under there, but now that it's no longer my DD, it's not practical for the amount of work involved. as another option, i could just sell this one and start over on another one. :D

[Lee]

do people get tired of them because of the vibration/noise or... some other reason???

i can put up with the noise, my truck has gotten nothing but noisier thanks to the skids, rear bumper, mt's, etc :laugh:

[bamachem]

my rarely vibrates on the highway. it will vibrate a little on hard bumps, but still not bad. however, w/ a 315 hanging out back, the visibility out the rear window is nil.

[Bighead]

[the frame is what gives - not the bumper]

the only way to fix that is to plate the frame and put some reinforcing struts (in an X pattern) where your current spare tire bracket is located.

Lee: What Andy said is correct. I honestly don't remember but I think it was made out of 3/16" also (Cheese or Steve would know for sure). The bumper itself was pretty stout but having all that extra weight in the back while flexing the back end would cause that thing to move around quite a bit. That is what caused the damage to my door. As long as you watch the clearance between the bumper and body you should be okay.

My biggest issue with it was the decrease in visibility (all it took was backing into something to see that ;) ) and how old it got having to unlatch the swing arm every time to get into the back. Like I said before, getting rid of it was one of my best mods.

[Lee]

i see. i think a bigger annoyance for me is not having room in my cargo area. i need it bad. i dont wanna tuck the spare underneath and i had a surco rack and can testify that those are a terrible solution -- bad mpg, more wind noise, more top heavy, less clearance under trees, cant get into garages in the city.... the list goes on and on.

[Good Times]

lee, i've got the 35's back there and man it really cramps the view. but then again it's better than throwing it under or inside as i don't have room on either front. one big diff that i have on mine is that mine is a tailgate setup (not the swing out). though it's more sturdy and doesn't vibrate one bit it is a mother to lower and raise cuz you're basically holding the weight of the tire as you lock the tailgate. as much as i love the design cuz it's rattle free and really doesn't go anywhere it's no fun opening and closing. i'm seriously considering a swing out design but can't figure out how to go about it.

note, over build everything (literally). better safe than sorry so if you need to reinforce and cross reinforce everything, do it. i'm definitely going to reading what you do as i need to figure out an alternative method of carrying my tire too.

[Lee]

yessir i plan to brace everything quite well. i overbuilt my bumper as is, that thing is indestructible, so i wouldnt skimp on something that can actually hurt me or someone else :thumbup:

i really appreciate the been-there knowledge :)

[Robinhood4x4]

When you guys say vibrate, do you mean noise or that it rubs on your truck? The only noise I notice from mine is the hi lift jack rattling. The carrier is pretty quiet...I think. I'm only using a bolt for a hinge, but it's in quadruple shear so it's pretty strong. The whole think can wiggle a lot if the bolt is loose but it still doesn't make much noise.

There's no way to stop the frame from twisting. You can reduce it, but not stop it. Everything is a spring. A 2" diameter bolt is a spring, your frame is a spring, your bones are springs. The solution is to build in lots of clearance between the bumper and the body. I've got about an inch between my bumper and the body and I've never even come close to hitting. An inch is too much though.

Also remember there's such a thing as too much steel. I know, I know. But more steel makes things heavy, putting more stress on things.

[Lee]

i am going to use a bolt as a pin for a backup to the hinge... so i think it'll hang on tight :)

i feel safe and confident in the bracing i already have for my bumper so chances are, it'll be plenty strong. i have a good inch or so of clearance as well :)

[Bighead]

Steve, my vibration was a bit of both. I could hear it rattling a bit on a smooth surface if my rear window was down, but not if it was up. Any kind of rough surface would cause my bumper to hit my body causing a distinctive sound. The problem with mine was it was built to tight to the body so every time the frame flexed a bit it did not have the clearance to stay away from the body. It seemed like the extra weight of the tire hanging off the back aggravated the issue. The weird thing was Darren never had that problem. Since they (Rockware) used Darren's truck as the template it appeared there were some differences between an 01 and 02 frame.

I won't whine about my old bumper anymore...just make sure you have plenty of clearance between the body and bumper.

[Lee]

1 thing

i got this latch:
http://www.carrlane.com/SiteData/FeatureImages/046_300pat_p.gif

then realized they have a version with a safety switch:
http://www.carrlane.com/SiteData/FeatureImages/CL-300-LPA_p.gif

should i have gotten that one?

[bamachem]

just use a pin as a safety and you'll be fine. i went w/ the safety latch instead of using a pin. make sure that the latch is mounted correctly as well. you'll want the lever to go just over center to help the latch stay closed as well.

[Lee]

gotcha :thumbup:

[salad_man]

1 thing

i got this latch:
http://www.carrlane.com/SiteData/FeatureImages/046_300pat_p.gif

then realized they have a version with a safety switch:
http://www.carrlane.com/SiteData/FeatureImages/CL-300-LPA_p.gif

should i have gotten that one?


oh I have been looking where to buy these, where did you purchase these?

[bamachem]

mcmaster-carr http://mcmaster.com

"Pull Action Toggle Clamp" Item 51335A68 on catalog page 2514 (online)

2000# rated capacity in stainless steel.

[Lee]

i bought mine at drillspot.com but mcmaster carr is great too

[Robinhood4x4]

Are you going to mock it up in cardboard first?

[bamachem]

I mocked up the rear bumper in foam-board, but I just built the carrier as I went.

[Lee]

Are you going to mock it up in cardboard first?
yessir! just like i did w/ my bumper build :)

[Lee]

well i just got the latch, it is really good quality! very impressed.

i assembled it on my desk this morning :)

[Lee]

well she's done :)

took darren's design and changed it :D came out really really strong, barely moves latch and hinge work nice.

http://www.toyotacrawlers.com/tirecarrier/1.jpg

http://www.toyotacrawlers.com/tirecarrier/2.jpg

http://www.toyotacrawlers.com/tirecarrier/3.jpg

http://www.toyotacrawlers.com/tirecarrier/4.jpg

[ADH8796]

Looks real nice.

[Ric]

very nicely done, Im starting to hate you guys with tire carriers :hillbill: I want one, but need a new tank first.
again, looks awesome :thumbup:

[Lee]

thanks guys. we took our time, did it right. its strong and sits really well.

we ended up using 2x2 since i couldnt get my hands on enough 2x3.

the latch system is my favorite part... it is 2x2 and what works out to be about 2.5x2 meeting eachother to keep it from moving up and down and to create a tight meeting point (thus no need for rubber or hdpe or whatever), then the latch secures them together.

works nice, sits tight.

now i need to get used to not using my rear window :laugh:

[slosurfer]

Looks really nice! Well done. Too bad someone stole one of your rear shackles.

[Lee]

yeah that happened months ago, hahah

i have been to lazy to get a new one

thanks for the reminder, ill go buy one right now :hillbill:

[bigwapitijohnny]

Looks great. Congrats on a fine job.

Regards,

BWJ

[Seanz0rz]

so when are you going to build me one? i will pay you handsomely for it too....

[neliconcept]

nice carrier lee, like how its almost a bit offcenter but its close to center lol.

btw is it me or is your truck leaning a little to the left?

[ecchamberlin]

Now my spare 315 rides tucked up in the stock spare location with a new crossmember (taller to take advantage of my 1.5" BL) made by Schaefer. Now it's tucked out of the way and no longer limits my rear visibility.


Any good pics of this. I am interested in how that was done.

[Lee]

nice carrier lee, like how its almost a bit offcenter but its close to center lol.

btw is it me or is your truck leaning a little to the left?

it does, but not as bad as that looks, that road is upside down U shaped.

[Lee]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CSRlyvuV0Cs

well i wheeled with it. came open once when i hit the the latch directly into the dirt while making a 3 (more like 15) point turn to go back and tug my friend who was stuck.... but beyond that it was great!

[Bob98SR5]

great job, lee. looks really nice. re busting the latch open, isn't there a place where you can stick a cotter pin through so that doesnt happen?

[Cheese]

This is why the Slee bumper has a hold open and hold closed pin.

Looks like a gppd project.

[bamachem]

definitely pin it if you don't switch over to the safety latch. if it popped open on a trail, then it could potentially do the same on the street w/ a big enough jolt.

[d0ubledown]

nice work man.. :thumbup: how did you mount the hinge to the bumper and was there any extra gusseting required? any close up pics?

[Robinhood4x4]

That was quick. Looks good Lee What's with the extra metal hanging off the end?

I'd also suggest you attach a safety cable on the hinge side, just in case it decides to break off on the freeway. I've heard of too many of these falling off.

[TroysToy]

Lee, your bumper looks awesome...I am subscribing because I like all of the options and am looking to do something.... :confused:

[Lee]

That was quick. Looks good Lee What's with the extra metal hanging off the end?

I'd also suggest you attach a safety cable on the hinge side, just in case it decides to break off on the freeway. I've heard of too many of these falling off.

what extra metal? if you mean at the latch:



thanks guys. we took our time, did it right. its strong and sits really well.
it is 2x2 and what works out to be about 2.5x2 meeting each other to keep it from moving up and down and to create a tight meeting point (thus no need for rubber or hdpe or whatever), then the latch secures them together.

works nice, sits tight.


do you have pics of the safety cable?

[Lee]

Lee, your bumper looks awesome...I am subscribing because I like all of the options and am looking to do something.... :confused:
haha thanks man.

ill keep updating. i plan to add a pin by the latch as a backup, and something to improve the safety at the hinge as suggested above :)

[Lee]

nice work man.. :thumbup: how did you mount the hinge to the bumper and was there any extra gusseting required? any close up pics?

its tough to explain in type... but i will take closeups soon (i dont have a camera anymore, mine broke :( but ill grab one) and post em up with an explanation :)

[Lee]

definitely pin it if you don't switch over to the safety latch. if it popped open on a trail, then it could potentially do the same on the street w/ a big enough jolt.
i agree, it needs some backup... but to be fair, the latch only came open because i dug it into the ground and had to back in and out of that position to get out, so it more or less was pulled open as though someone had pulled it open by hand, if that makes sense.

ill be putting in a pin soon!

sorry i couldnt reply to all the comments till today, between work and getting some much needed camping done, i havent had much time to post up :)

[cougarfreak]

McMaster-Carr has some real nice pins I plan on using on my carrier, tho I can't seem to find them or what the heck they're called (sorry :roll:). They weld on to your swing arm. I plan on putting one at either end of the arm... one near the pivot so when you swing the carrier open, it can only go so far, then one near the latch for those unforseen situations where it comes open accidentally.
http://www.cougarfreakphoto.com/files/Tire%20carrier%20scetch.jpg
http://www.cougarfreakphoto.com/files/Tire%20carrier%20latch.jpg
http://www.cougarfreakphoto.com/files/Tire%20carrier%20latch%20alt.jpg

I haven't built this yet as it's not high on the priority list, but I've had the hardware for 2 years now :hillbill:

[Lee]

yeah i found a lot of good stuff from them, but also direct from carr-lane

here are some of them:

http://www.carrlane.com/Catalog/index.cfm/27625071F0B221118070C1C513E111D081B0006280B1713050 245221E0107070F1A3C3B28535640

[cougarfreak]

Those hitch pins would work too, but this is what I'm using. I'll look for what their called and a part # and post when I find it.
http://www.cougarfreakphoto.com/files/IMG_5011%20Carrier%20safe%20pin%20pieces.jpg
http://www.cougarfreakphoto.com/files/IMG_5012carrier%20safe%20pin.jpg

[bamachem]

:thumbup:

make sure to get the ALL STAINLESS version. the carbon steel version will rust up and seize in the snow belt very quickly.

[Lee]

Those hitch pins would work too, but this is what I'm using. I'll look for what their called and a part # and post when I find it.
http://www.cougarfreakphoto.com/files/IMG_5011%20Carrier%20safe%20pin%20pieces.jpg
http://www.cougarfreakphoto.com/files/IMG_5012carrier%20safe%20pin.jpg
sweet! i like those better, please do post that up for me.

[cougarfreak]

I've seen them used on some of the Land Cruiser bumpers, Slee, Kaymar are two I remember that use these pins. I'll keep looking for them and get you a part #. The sleeve is 0.25 wall and you'd weld that to your swing arm. On the pivot pin, I'm only going to drill a hoe for when the swig is open. That way I don't have to undo the latch, then have to go to the pivot to release the pin as well. The pin will float on the base until it reaches full open, then it would pop down into the hole I drill there... not sure if I'm being clear about this... If not I'll draw a pic and post it. I do much better with pics.

[Lee]

i get what you mean, im more or less planning the same.

please let me know asap where and a P/N, i need to get this finished, so i am looking to buy now :D

[cougarfreak]

gotit!!!

[cougarfreak]

goto http://www.mcmaster.com/
type in 3239 in the "find" window (that's the page they're on)
about mid page and they're called "weld in pull pins"
Happy welding!!!!

I didn't do stainless, I'll just keep it gooped with grease and see how that goes. I haven't welded stainless, so I went with what I knew. They are getting back to me whether the whole thing is stainless or just the pin and not the barrel (barrel being the part you'd weld to the swing) My zinc plated one is only the pin, the barrel is mild weldable steel.

[Lee]

YES, thank you!!!!!

i am purchasing now. thanks again man

[Lee]

are you getting the locking or non locking?? i am confused on what that means.

sounds to me like i want the locking so i can turn the handle to hold it in the unlocked position if i wish??

[cougarfreak]

YES, I have the nonlocking kind. I figure that's way more redundancy than I need, but to each his own.

[Lee]

thanks i actually changed my mind and bought the non locking ones :)

thanks again!

[Lee]

ok my pins arrived. im a little concerned because the actual body of the pin that is left after the spring is rather short (like maybe 1.5" max). this doesnt seem like it is enough.

also i think ill order a 3rd one that is locking. to have both unlocked will be annoying, ill make it so the one at the hinge does not lock, but the one at the latch does.

[cougarfreak]

I think you got the shorter ones. The ones I got are these:

pin useable barrel
1/2" 9/16" 1" 2 1/4"
90222A118â€* 12.66
_______ ___

â€* Usable length is 5/8". Barrel length is 3".

[Lee]

yeah looks like i selected wrong :(

oh well ill order the right ones. i looked at the numbers and i mustve just read it wrong.

i can use the ones i got for the umbrella stand im making my sister! :D

[cougarfreak]

NICE!!!!!!!!!!

[Lee]

here are some new pics, mostly by request

http://kidmoe.com/4runner/tirecarrier/6.jpg

http://kidmoe.com/4runner/tirecarrier/5.jpg

http://kidmoe.com/4runner/tirecarrier/7.jpg

lic plate light
http://kidmoe.com/4runner/tirecarrier/8.jpg

http://kidmoe.com/4runner/tirecarrier/9.jpg

the latch
http://kidmoe.com/4runner/tirecarrier/10.jpg

http://kidmoe.com/4runner/tirecarrier/11.jpg

[ecchamberlin]

Awesome Lee! Nice work.

[Seanz0rz]

now i REALLY REALLY want one!!!

i have it all mapped out in my head too, i know just exactly how im going to solve the problem of the weak hinge. just sucks not having access to metal working tools...

very nice job!

[Lee]

i should post closeups of my hinge, the way we did it, it is VERY strong. if the bearings let go, that whole piece isnt going anywhere, itll stay put because it is welded through... the only thing that would happen is the thing not turning if the bearings die. when i put the backup pins in, this thing will be perfect.

[slosurfer]

Wow, that is nice!

[Lee]

closeups on the hinge

http://kidmoe.com/4runner/629random/5.jpg

http://kidmoe.com/4runner/629random/6.jpg

[ecchamberlin]

The hing looks plenty strong. THe way the latch is designed seems to be what will keep the hing from breaking. The latch looks like it will have all the weight on it and that thing looks beefy! Good to Go.

[cougarfreak]

does the pivot post go all the way thru the square tubing and welded on bottom and top, or is it just welded to the top?

[Lee]

all the way through, welded on the bottom and top. worked out beautifully. my friend has a steady hand with a hole saw :D

[Lee]

ill take a pic soon :thumbup:

[cougarfreak]

Nice!!!!!

[Lee]

added in the safety pin for the latch at last. ill post pics soon, i am moving apartments this week, so its been hectic.

it came out ok, need to fix it up a bit, shore up where the pin locks to (so it doesnt go oblong, and if it does, so it wont go so oblong that it is ineffective) but so far so good! :thumbup:

one piece of advice to those building these things.. definitely account for these pins ahead of time and put them in asap. my latch is just fine but it has loosened up since the first install. i tightened it a bit, still have more to do, but just for safeties sake, account for it ahead of time :)


just need to add a pin for the hinge now :)