Bolt-On Tundra Brake Upgrade for 96-02 4Runners

[bamachem]

Well, i've bitten the bullet and i'm going to do a full brake upgrade.

Up front, i've ordered Tundra Brembo Rotors (plain face) from tirerack for $112 shipped.

I'll match up some OEM front pads from trdparts4u (about $60) along with some remanufactured calipers (199mm) from autozone ($140). the rear 4runner shoes (1999) and tundra 199mm front pads (for a 2001) were $109.61 online, shipped from strap22 on yotatech (phil at toyotapartsales.com).

2001 Tundra Remanufactured Calipers from Autozone (two)
2001 Tundra Brembo Rotors from Tirerack (two)
2001 Tundra OEM Pads (199mm) from a dealer (one set)
2001 Tundra Brake Pad Retaining Pins from a dealer (4)

In the rear, I'm just putting OEM shoes from trdparts4u and a sonoran steel stainless brake line. while I have the drums off, I'll have them resurfaced and clean everything up. the rears are the original set of shoes, and still have lots of material left, but that's really due to the lack of function for quite some time. I've had some pretty bad brake performance fade and i just discovered that i have a leaky rear seal on the passenger side. I'll swap both seals out while i'm doing the brakes.

Update 1:

I called the local advance. they can get them in tomorrow morning, they will price match autozone at $69.99 each + $50 core (instead of $85 each), and i can return them to any store for the core credit. price is $153.28 after core refund. :D


The total upgrade price will be $375 for everything except the stainless lines, including all shipping, core refunds, etc. That's OEM reman calipers w/ a lifetime warranty, new rear OEM shoes, new front OEM pads, and brembo blank rotors - a serious upgrade over stock runner stuff.

The total to just get new front rotors, pads, & rear shoes would be about $225. For $150 upgrade on the calipers, I get better, non-fading, more powerful brakes. Not bad at all.

I'll have the calipers tomorrow, then the shoes/pads, and rotors hopefully by monday. I'll probably pull the fronts and swap calipers this weekend, bleed them out, and swap suspension stuff around, then next week all I'll have to do is put on the rotors and pads and go for a drive.

Update 2:

ok, done... :D

I have pics, but i left the camera at home, so they'll have to get uploaded later. i started at about 8:30 or so last night and got into bed at 5 after 1. ufff. that's hard on an old man.

I pulled the calipers and took some good comparison shots. The calipers on my 99 limited were stamped S13WM and the 199mm tundra calipers are S12WE. They are the exact same dimensions in every aspect except for the inner "void" where the pads rest. On the tundra caliper, that void is about 1/4" larger to accomodate the wider rotor. The rotors are halla beefy and really nice. The tundra pads have a lot more surface area for friction as well. I didn't even have to trim the dust shield since they are the same size as my OEM calipers. I got everything on and had a BIG problem - contact between the wheels and calipers! I had to clearance the highspots on the caliper closest to the hub, but that was really nothing w/ a variable speed grinder and a 80-grip paper wheel. I touched up the clearanced spots w/ some flat black just to protect it from rust. I bled everything out, then moved to the rears.... uff. The driver side was OK, and I just cleaned and adjusted it. On the passenger side - it was a different story. I not only had a rear seal leak that has coated everything in 75W90, but i also have a rear caliper piston dust boot that's squirting fluid. that means that i have a leak at that piston! arrrrgh! I guess I'll be changing the rears soon too. Now i'm glad that i didn't get those $$$$ shoes from the dealer. Anyway, I got things cleaned up to decent shape and put everything back together and went for a drive.

WOW!

Very nice! my front rotors were in bad shape and grooved, but the stopping power has NEVER been this good, even w/ OEM 4runner pads and stock resurfaced rotors. I'd say that over new stock stuff, the stopping power has increased at least 20% and probably more like 30%. over the performance that i was having w/ my crappy rotors - well over 50% increase. before i had to put the pedal to the floor to stop with any force at all. now all I have to do is tap it to about 30-40% and it will stop on a dime!

overall, I was going to have to replace pads and rotors anyway, so the extra $200 for new calipers that allowed me to upgrade to thicker rotors and pads w/ more surface area was WELL SPENT!


Update 3:

pics...

http://4rnr.net/images/p5240402.jpg

http://4rnr.net/images/p5240403.jpg

http://4rnr.net/images/p5240404.jpg

http://4rnr.net/images/p5240405.jpg

http://4rnr.net/images/p5240406.jpg

http://4rnr.net/images/p5240407.jpg

http://4rnr.net/images/p5240408.jpg

http://4rnr.net/images/p5240411.jpg

http://4rnr.net/images/p5240412.jpg

http://4rnr.net/images/p5240413.jpg

http://4rnr.net/images/p5240414.jpg

http://4rnr.net/images/p5240415.jpg


Update 4:

(from Fingers' old thread)...

4.7" pads = D812 = 199mm calipers = 2000~early 2003.
5.3" pads = D976 = 231mm calipers = late 2003~present plus front brake TSB changes.

http://www.tundrasolutions.com/photopost/data/500/Brake_Pad_Comparison.jpg





In my opinion, the BEST pads are OEM - no doubt. the other "raybestos" type long-life pads typically last quite a while, but they chew up your rotors.

Why do you think midas can do a lifetime brake pad job for $50 or something crazy cheap? it's cause you have to go in and have your rotors resurfaced ever 6 months (paying about $25-$40 each) just to keep them from vibrating and squealing. that takes life out of the rotors and the pads actually wear them down more cause the pads are extremely hard compared to the soft rotors that they sell. You'll weat out a set of rotors in a couple years, then to keep your "lifetime brakes" in good standing, you have to get rotors from them at about $250 a set. Then the snowball continues down that hill...

There's a reason for hard metal rotors and soft non-metallic pads. My OEM rotors have lasted 154k miles and still have life. It's on it's second set of pads with plenty of life. there's not may aftermarket brands you could say that about...

[MTL_4runner]

Nice writeup on this Andy!

I've had my 199mm calipers sitting in my garage for most of the winter so I'm looking forward to putting them on when the snow is finally gone. Hope to get some pics up myself soon.

[Lee]

next time i need new pads, im doing this.

id love to convert the rear to discs too. . .

[bamachem]

converting the rears to discs is a pain in the butt. you'd be better off getting a D44 from an Isuzu Rodeo that already has discs w/ the tiny little built-in drum for an e-brake. you can get them w/ matching toyota ratios if you stay 4.88 or below as well. you'll need an ARB when you do that though to go in the D44.

[Lee]

i didnt know those came with d44's...

yeah i wouldnt do the conversion in reality, not because as you said its a PITA, but because for all that effort and money id rather sas or go longtravel or something.

i dont think ill ever sas my truck... namely because its an 01 with all the fancy computers that hate solid axles and love stupid ABS.

ill sas an older runner someday.... :lliar:

ok, now back on topic..... :biggrinking:

[MTL_4runner]

I decided long ago to not bother with the rear disc conversion because all the options left you hanging as far as being able to have any sort of decent e-brake. I do need to redo my drums this summer too because both the parking brake bellcranks are toast.

[bamachem]

agreed. a swap is better than a conversion due to the e-brake alone. (should be less than $1500 if you get an ARB locker, a junk-yard axle, gears, and new springs - if you do the work yourself)

[Lee]

my e-brake hasn't worked in 4 months... i really need to get on that :confused2:

[MTL_4runner]

Chances are good your bellcranks are toast too.

That's definately the weak link on these darn drums.

[Lee]

i loosened it when i did the rear drums, and never tightened it again, thats all... i really should get on that.

[MTL_4runner]

i loosened it when i did the rear drums, and never tightened it again, thats all... i really should get on that.


Really?
I never had to touch mine when I do rear brakes.

[Lee]

it wasnt a necessity, i just sorta did it, then forgot to retighten

[marko3xl3]

I have a couple quick question for you bema...and actually everbody else who knows, as I am planning to do this mod in a bit.

1) How difficult is it to rebuild a caliper, and did you just use a generic or Toyota kit?
2) Are OEM calipers significantly better then lets say Raybestos ones?

Just trying to add some simplicity to my project.

TIA!

[bamachem]

i didn't rebuild them. i bought them already rebuilt/refurbished. :D

[surf4runner]

:great: write-up

is the slight wear on the inside of the rim a result of new calipers???

[drguitarum2005]

Whats the word on this mod working on equal generation tacomas?

[Seanz0rz]

i wonder if the tundra calipers would clear the wheels i have now. with the stock 4runner ones, there is barely any clearance!

i have those generic d window wheels they sell at america's tire.

[MTL_4runner]

Whats the word on this mod working on equal generation tacomas?


I have seen a few people do this on a Tacoma and it worked very well. Only trick is to drill out the end of the brake line bolt so it doesn't bottom out. Other than that the procedure is more or less identical to doing it on a 4runner.

Bolt should look like this:
http://argonzero.dyndns.org/tundra%20brake%20install%20nov%202006/IMG_4565.JPG

Brake line also needs to be held in place while tightening:
http://argonzero.dyndns.org/tundra%20brake%20install%20nov%202006/IMG_4593.JPG

[Smitherz]

Wow what a great mod. I'm definitely game for this. The stock Taco brakes are the best brakes I've ever seen on a stock truck and upgrading to the larger style would be insane. This is awesome.

Oh I built a completely different rear suspension for my truck and have been to lazy to build an emergency brake system. If you have the V6 you shouldn't have to worry about the truck rolling anywhere if left in gear. The 4cyl might creep on you though when parked. After my new engine work I'll put a disc on the trans output shaft. Thanks for the brake info.

[TroysToy]

:thumbup: I agree about it being an awesome mod. With the way people drive around here, any help I can get stopping faster, the better.

[cox380]

what do you think about ceramic pads. They are suppose to be better all around(braking, wear, and noise) and with no brake dust. Plus they pretty cheap. I put the Reybestos Quiet Stop Ceramics in about 1000 miles ago and I'm lovin them. I never thought about rotor wear though? hopefully they won't kill my rotors.

[xcmountain80]

So how much bigger are these than my 16" wheel option calipers? new rotors are needed as well or no?

Aaron

[bamachem]

they are wider, and use a pad that has more contact area. they also require new, wider rotors that have more mass (stronger and more heat sink so they won't warp like the originals)

also, i fixed the pics...

[4RunAmok]

I can't wait to do this on my 99 4runner!

Do you have exact part numbers you purchased?

[bosco659]

I did the Tundra brake upgrade on my '00 Runner around Christmas time and this is by far the most impressive brake upgrade I have ever done (even compared to installing 13" rotors with 4 piston Wilwoods on my Supra)! Stopping power is nothing less than phenomenal and I get no fade after hard braking and no signs of warpage of the rotors. :) I installed rebuilt 199mm Tundra calipers, Brembo slotted, cross drilled rotors, Hawk HPS brake pads and SS lines. Friends that have driven my truck have commented that it is the best braking vehicle that they have ever driven. Not bad for a truck that I would have previously characterized as having the worst brakes of any vehicle that I have ever owned!

Highly recommended mod - for safety's sake!

[bamachem]

I did the Tundra brake upgrade on my '00 Runner around Christmas time and this is by far the most impressive brake upgrade I have ever done (even compared to installing 13" rotors with 4 piston Wilwoods on my Supra)! Stopping power is nothing less than phenomenal and I get no fade after hard braking and no signs of warpage of the rotors. :) I installed rebuilt 199mm Tundra calipers, Brembo slotted, cross drilled rotors, Hawk HPS brake pads and SS lines. Friends that have driven my truck have commented that it is the best braking vehicle that they have ever driven. Not bad for a truck that I would have previously characterized as having the worst brakes of any vehicle that I have ever owned!

Highly recommended mod - for safety's sake!


:thumbup: :D

[4RunAmok]

Again, I ask for the exact model numbers, because there are like 7 different Tundra's to choose from when ordering on the web plus various years. Details your write-up doesn't include. Unless I'm totally blind and missed something in your write-up.

What year rotors? 4WD? 2WD? Is there a difference?
What model pads? 4WD? 2WD? Again, is there a difference?
What model Caliper?

[Elton]

looks easy so the rotors just pop off after you undo the claipers ?

[bamachem]

Again, I ask for the exact model numbers, because there are like 7 different Tundra's to choose from when ordering on the web plus various years. Details your write-up doesn't include. Unless I'm totally blind and missed something in your write-up.

What year rotors? 4WD? 2WD? Is there a difference?
What model pads? 4WD? 2WD? Again, is there a difference?
What model Caliper?


you have every piece of info that you need to do the job...


Up front, i've ordered Tundra Brembo Rotors (plain face) from tirerack for $112 shipped.

I'll match up some OEM front pads from trdparts4u (about $60) along with some remanufactured calipers (199mm) from autozone ($140). the rear 4runner shoes (1999) and tundra 199mm front pads (for a 2001) were $109.61 online, shipped from strap22 on yotatech (phil at toyotapartsales.com).

2001 Tundra Remanufactured Calipers from Autozone (two)
2001 Tundra Brembo Rotors from Tirerack (two)
2001 Tundra OEM Pads (199mm) from a dealer (one set)
2001 Tundra Brake Pad Retaining Pins from a dealer (4)

part numbers change on a whim. giving part numbers might help NOW, but they may be wrong a year or two from now. also, a part number won't help anyone who goes to a salvage yard to look for the calipers.

no offense, but if you can't find what you're looking for with that info, then you don't have the technical ability to complete the job. i ordered pads from a 2001 Tundra from the dealer. common sense should tell you that everything else was for the same year since they have to match in order for them to work properly.

looking at this pic, you can see that the 2000-2003 model years are the same brake pads and same calipers. that would tell you that the year range that you're looking for.

http://www.tundrasolutions.com/photopost/data/500/Brake_Pad_Comparison.jpg

[MTL_4runner]

looks easy so the rotors just pop off after you undo the claipers ?


Yes

[Elton]

wow really thats great i thought it would be like my 93 i had now i can fix the warped rotors my self

[4RunAmok]

you have every piece of info that you need to do the job...


Up front, i've ordered Tundra Brembo Rotors (plain face) from tirerack for $112 shipped.

I'll match up some OEM front pads from trdparts4u (about $60) along with some remanufactured calipers (199mm) from autozone ($140). the rear 4runner shoes (1999) and tundra 199mm front pads (for a 2001) were $109.61 online, shipped from strap22 on yotatech (phil at toyotapartsales.com).

2001 Tundra Remanufactured Calipers from Autozone (two)
2001 Tundra Brembo Rotors from Tirerack (two)
2001 Tundra OEM Pads (199mm) from a dealer (one set)
2001 Tundra Brake Pad Retaining Pins from a dealer (4)

part numbers change on a whim. giving part numbers might help NOW, but they may be wrong a year or two from now. also, a part number won't help anyone who goes to a salvage yard to look for the calipers.

no offense, but if you can't find what you're looking for with that info, then you don't have the technical ability to complete the job. i ordered pads from a 2001 Tundra from the dealer. common sense should tell you that everything else was for the same year since they have to match in order for them to work properly.

looking at this pic, you can see that the 2000-2003 model years are the same brake pads and same calipers. that would tell you that the year range that you're looking for.


I kinda thought that might sound like I was being a jerk, that really wasn't my intention.

I honestly didn't/don't know that the parts are the same for the various models of Tundra (2wd/4wd, v6/v8, etc..)

I was HOPING this was the case. I'm actually am pretty tech savvy, but when it comes to items I'm not informed upon, I like to do my homework.

It would suck to get the toys back home and realize that there's no difference than stock because I bought the 2WD vs the 4WD rotors and tried to put in the wrong size pads.

Please take my regrets for sounding like I meant YOU didn't provide proper info, I was just requiring more information than I needed.

Your work on this is very appreciated, I can assure you of that.

[bamachem]

ok, thanks for the explanation and sorry for taking it the wrong way!

[pdxsteve]

thanks 4runamok, I'm glad I didn't ask your question first. :flipoff: no, seriously, thanks bamachem for clearing that up, I tend to be pretty particular and love to have all the details but I guess that in this case, it's just that easy. great writeup!

[4RunAmok]

I think that's exactly what this is, a case of "It just can't be that easy!" And it really is.

The only thing I'm left confused about is the wheel the did the scraping. Was this the 3-paired six spoke, or the 5 spoke star pattern?

[bamachem]

it was a set of LX450 wheels.

[MTL_4runner]

I finally got time to get all the parts to do the Tundra Caliper install this weekend.
I'll try and take some before and after pics on mine too.

Did anyone ever try the spare tire to make sure it didn't contact the calipers?

[bamachem]

Did anyone ever try the spare tire to make sure it didn't contact the calipers?


ummmm, not the original stock one. mine is the same as the other 4 - LX450 wheels...

[firebane]

So a simple recap.. Tundra Rotors, 199mm calipers and new pads is a simple bolt on and drive away procedue for our 4runners?

Yeehaw. Mine have bad shudder and I'd rather save up a bit more to do this myself.

[MTL_4runner]

So a simple recap.. Tundra Rotors, 199mm calipers and new pads is a simple bolt on and drive away procedue for our 4runners?


Depending on what rims you're using you may have some grinding to do on the caliper, but it's not going to be much. Other than that, nope, it's a bolt on procedure for 3rd gen 4runners (using the Tundra Rotors, 199mm calipers and pads.....the 231mm calipers are a bit more work to get fitted).

You can see where Bamachem had to grind a bit in this pic:
http://4rnr.net/images/p5240415.jpg

[d0ubledown]

yup..my LC (same as lx450) wheels rubbed abit on the calipers. had to grind down the calipers a bit. but when i rotated tires..the grinding came back but i didnt have a chance to hit the caliper with the grinder some more..so i just let the wheel 'self machine' lol. its the tinyest amount of rub, i wasnt to worried about it grinding itself clear of the caliper...

[firebane]

yup..my LC (same as lx450) wheels rubbed abit on the calipers. had to grind down the calipers a bit. but when i rotated tires..the grinding came back but i didnt have a chance to hit the caliper with the grinder some more..so i just let the wheel 'self machine' lol. its the tinyest amount of rub, i wasnt to worried about it grinding itself clear of the caliper...


Can you explain to me what you mean by the LC and LX450 rims? I've seen that a few times now.

[MTL_4runner]

Can you explain to me what you mean by the LC and LX450 rims? I've seen that a few times now.


LC = Land Cruiser

This is a Lexus LX450 (Lexus' version of the LC.....notice the rims, same as Bamachem)
http://www.spokanister.net/images_web/LX450_John/LX450-028.JPG

[d0ubledown]

Can you explain to me what you mean by the LC and LX450 rims? I've seen that a few times now.


LC = Land Cruiser

This is a Lexus LX450 (Lexus' version of the LC.....notice the rims, same as Bamachem)
http://www.spokanister.net/images_web/LX450_John/LX450-028.JPG


funny..that LX acutallly has LC wheels on it?!? the LX wheels like bamachems have a slice down the 5 spokes. LC's dont.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v389/d0ubledown/cars/PICT2489web.jpg

firebane: hey..another BC'er! welcome man!

[bamachem]

those above are LC wheels, even the ones on the Lexus in that pic.

these are LX450 wheels... (they are the same as the LC wheels, but they have the painted groove down the middle of each spindle.)

http://4rnr.net/runner5.jpg

[firebane]

ah thanks. definitely like those.

Guess I'll be starting to save up for this brake swap!

doubledown, yup I am :D

[MTL_4runner]

I did a test fit for my calipers today and it looks like the 199mm (S13WE) calipers clear every rim I'm running (stock 3 spoke alum, sport alum and the steel spare tire) with no grinding at all. The dust shield fits fine as well with no cutting so it looks like everyhting is a go for the weekend. I can't wait to see how well these will stop compared to the 4runner's old brakes (you can see how heavy duty they are when you pick an old/new rotor up in each hand). I managed to pull a dumbass move and just used a floor jack to hold up the front while I was working on the test-fit. The A-arm slid off the jack and stopped under the CV joint (which cut one of the inner boots). I probably needed to change the boots anyway since they had been slowly leaking since I did the lift, but it just sucks that I have to do it sooner instead of later. Anyway, lesson learned, always put your stuff up on jackstands before working on it!

[firebane]

I want to build one of GSGALLANT's cool brake bleeder setups so I don't do any more damage to my master cylinder by pumping the brakes manually (plus it makes it a one person job which is great).

http://f3.yahoofs.com/users/41b6b1acz6e60a49e/4296/__sr_/1b16.jpg?phAEYeGBUED9qjCg

http://f3.yahoofs.com/users/41b6b1acz6e60a49e/4296/__sr_/7c8d.jpg?phAEYeGB07dpqvtc


Images don't work and whats this great brake bleeder?

[DoubleZero4x4]

For those of you considering this mod...

I did this mod 2 years (30,000 miles) ago for my 4Runner and about a year ago for the wife's 4Runner. There have been no issues to date (knock on wood) and I still have about 85% left on the pads for my truck. We have the stock 16" wheels and had no clearance issues with the S13WE (199mm) calipers. A little grinding on the dust shield for rotor clearance was the extent of the 'real work' I had to do. The mod is probably as simple as a brake job with a brake fluid flush. Really!

I put together a write-up but it seems to match what bama posted so I will save the repeat.

[MTL_4runner]

Ok, just got done doing the mod myself FINALLY and all I can say is WOW, the stopping power is incredible. My only gripe (as others had mentioned) is that the pedal goes down a bit further than before (which might indicate more caliper piston volume as we had suspected earlier when the validity of this mod was being debated.....I don't think there's any doubt now), but once it grabs, don't push too hard beyond that or you'll be kissing the dashboard in no time flat. Andy did a great job on the writeup so I'm not going to do much other than post more pics for people (since you can never have enough of those!). The job was very easy (esp with the power bleeder) and shouldn't take people more than 2 hours total using air tools. I also found that the power bleeder works best around 15-20 psi (I'm sure you could even go higher before you started having issues with the reservoir, but it's risky and not necessary to bleed the brakes well). No cutting, no grinding, just bolt on and go for a drive. Very impressive mod to say the least and well worth the time spent! :thumbup:

[MTL_4runner]

Here's the pics....

Original 4runner brakes
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v648/mtl_4runner/Tundra%20Brakes/4runnertundrabrakes003Large.jpg

Old Calipers are off
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v648/mtl_4runner/Tundra%20Brakes/4runnertundrabrakes005Large.jpg

Completed Tundra brake swap
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v648/mtl_4runner/Tundra%20Brakes/4runnertundrabrakes007Large.jpg

Brake bleeder setup
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v648/mtl_4runner/Tundra%20Brakes/4runnertundrabrakes008Large.jpg

[MTL_4runner]

Since everyone likes to know what are good brands of cheap parts I wanted to say that I decided not to go the more expensive Akebono pads / Brembo rotors route because quite frankly they're a hassle to get from the US (very heavy to ship) and expensive when you find them up here. So I've been using the Parts Master brand OE replacement brake parts and I've found them to be a very good bang for the buck. The pads I got said they were made by Morse in small print and had the P/N MKD812S on the side. The rotors said made in China, but are actually quite good and come fully balanced (you'll see a slice in the edge of the rotor where the cooling fins are). They actually had several part numbers on them so I won't put them all up and confuse people, but I simply asked for rotors from a 2002 Toyota Tundra and those are what they gave me which fit perfectly. I've used this brand for the brakes on both my 4runner and my Civic and the pads / rotors hold up very well with no warping or brake fade and appear to use OE braking materials. The pads were about $46 CDN and the rotors were about $52 CDN each so you'll be out the door for about $150 CDN plus tax. Not too bad IMHO! Just thought I'd share anyway.

Parts Master brand:
http://www.800autotalk.com/showpage.php?page_id=partsmaster.htm&menu=store.menu

[bamachem]

jamie, you've GOT to share the details on your brake bleeder! :D

[914Runner]

jamie, you've GOT to share the details on your brake bleeder! :D

Here ya go!: http://www.ultimateyota.com/index.php?option=com_smf&Itemid=26&topic=1726.0

[MTL_4runner]

jamie, you've GOT to share the details on your brake bleeder! :D


I'll send you the TPS memo. :P

[MTL_4runner]

I wanted to follow up with what I mentioned before because it seems that over time as the pads have seated themselves the brakes have gotten firmer to the point where the pedal is alot firmer than before doing the swap. I doubt this firmer pedal is solely due to the brake bleeder.:laugh: I am even more impressed than I was when I first put them on.....it's the way the truck should have come right from the factory! In any case it's a very good mod and I highly recommended doing it.

[MTL_4runner]

I was looking at the way I had these installed and tried to find info to verify but I have seen it installed a few different ways in the pics people took. Does anyone know for sure if the spring clip is supposed to be on the top or bottom of the caliper? I tried to rationalize it myself, but it's alot easier just to figure out how it was designed to be on a Tundra.

[Seanz0rz]

i kinda thought you were suppose to have 2 clips per caliper? maybe im wrong.

[MTL_4runner]

Ok, I found my own answer thanks to the guys over at TS.

First there is only one spring clip on the caliper assembly. Second, the springs in my first pic are upside down (which might explain the excessive brake dust I've seen lately). It's really not a huge issue but if you're doing the mod, just pay attention better than I did. :P I'll flip those tonight, but the attached pic is how they should be.

I also included a pic of the caliper rebuild kit (so you can see what is included if you're so inclined).

[DoubleZero4x4]

Gee...Maybe I should have posted my writeup. I even mention the return spring and that it needs to go on the leading edge (driving forward) of the rotor.

[Seanz0rz]

how much is the rebuild kit from the stealer? sorry if this question has been answered before.

[MTL_4runner]

how much is the rebuild kit from the stealer? sorry if this question has been answered before.



Last time I saw it was $13, but they can be hard to track down.
It's also pretty rare that used calipers are so bad they need to be rebuilt.

[97kurt]

Last time I saw it was $13, but they can be hard to track down.
It's also pretty rare that used calipers are so bad they need to be rebuilt.



The set I got from car-part.com where in need of a rebuild. They probably would of worked but why take the chance with brakes.

[97Limited]

Did this Upgrade last year, and there still going strong!!

IMO a must do Upgrade..

[NHEric]

Anybody ever have a problem returning there cores...LOL Sucks too be the guy on the other end when after they rebuild the 4runner cores and send them back out as tundra calipers.

[MTL_4runner]

Anybody ever have a problem returning there cores...LOL Sucks too be the guy on the other end when after they rebuild the 4runner cores and send them back out as tundra calipers.

I didn't have cores (bought mine used) but there's not much chance of getting a set of 4runner calipers instead because they'll figure out pretty quickly they aren't Tundra cores just by looking the casting number on the side when they go to rebuild them. The parts guy behind the counter rarely has any idea what is getting returned as a core, nor do they really care. It's really the rebuild company that gets cheated in that case. Is it a good thing to do?....not really.....does it happen often?.....yep, all the time.

[NHEric]

I know it happens all the time, LOL I work at a honda dealer in the Parts dept. We get some stuff from honda reman sometimes that was returned boxed wrong. I don't care myself. From the eye it can be tough too see the differance in these calipers as there only a bit wider.

I checked out car-parts and I found some used ones for 50 each in my area. I am going too call my buddy over at napa and see what price he has.

I am glad I found this post, cause my rotors are shaking a bit.

[MTL_4runner]

I checked out car-parts and I found some used ones for 50 each in my area. I am going too call my buddy over at napa and see what price he has.

$50 is a good price for a used set of calipers....I doubt NAPA could touch a reman'd set for less than 4x-6x that price. I got my set off eBay for $50 on a "buy it now" from a guy who decided not to put them on his project vehicle (not to mention he had no idea what vehicle they were from......all he had were the casting numbers on the side, S13WE which I obviously picked up on right away :D ). I would still maintain this is one of the best mods you can do on a 3rd gen.

[Rock Slide]

Looks like I'll be doing an entire brake job sooner than not. (My front and rears are getting tired.) I might have to look into this mod...for the price, it's not much more than stock replacement parts.

[NHEric]

I checked out car-parts and I found some used ones for 50 each in my area. I am going too call my buddy over at napa and see what price he has.

$50 is a good price for a used set of calipers....I doubt NAPA could touch a reman'd set for less than 4x-6x that price. I got my set off eBay for $50 on a "buy it now" from a guy who decided not to put them on his project vehicle (not to mention he had no idea what vehicle they were from......all he had were the casting numbers on the side, S13WE which I obviously picked up on right away :D ). I would still maintain this is one of the best mods you can do on a 3rd gen.


That was for each one. I might just get them and rebuild them and also rebuild my current ones. if anything I can sell them on ebay :thumbup: See what happens. I had no time today too call around and get prices. Hopefully do that tommorow. I will let you know. The price at napa should be around 60-70 each with our discount we get through my work.

Eric

[97kurt]

Added a page to the wiki on rebuilding calipers. To those that have also done it, please edit/add anything I might of missed.

http://www.ultimateyota.com/index.php?option=com_openwiki&Itemid=60&id=wiki:front_caliper_rebuild

[Ian Rogers]

Just a FYI, I did the 231mm 13wl upgrade this weekend. My 5 spoke stock 2000 4runner wheels fit with out grinding. A had to cut the dust shield with tin snips (yes that easy). I dont feel like there is any more breaking power, but the shakes are gone. Maybe one the break seat in things will get better, and tighter. If not i am going to get a tundra MC to see if that will tighten them up more.

[bamachem]

are you sure you got them bled properly? i could tell an immediate difference in braking w/ the 199's after i swapped them over.

[Bighead]

Just out of curiosity, has anyone done this with anything other than stock or LC wheels? I'm wondering if there would be any issues with my MT Classic IIs (3.5" BS).

[MTL_4runner]

are you sure you got them bled properly? i could tell an immediate difference in braking w/ the 199's after i swapped them over.



Ditto.....definately use the homemade power bleeder if you have an air compressor.
The power bleeding seemed to firm up my pedal quite a bit over bleeding manually despite the larger Tundra caliper.

[Ian Rogers]

well today i have done some hard braking and they are much better now that the pads have seated. I have plans to bleed they once more because i did not have a rubber mallet to hit the caliper with when i was installing them. Some times little bits of air stick to the inside of the caliper, if you hit the caliper with a mallet they are released. Yes i did use the SUPER COOL Home depot power bleeder, thanks for the write up.

[MTL_4runner]

well today i have done some hard braking and they are much better now that the pads have seated. I have plans to bleed they once more because i did not have a rubber mallet to hit the caliper with when i was installing them. Some times little bits of air stick to the inside of the caliper, if you hit the caliper with a mallet they are released. Yes i did use the SUPER COOL Home depot power bleeder, thanks for the write up.


Ian, did you also clean the new rotors off with brake cleaner before install?
Sometimes people forget and the light oil keeps the pads from biting well unitl the oil burns off.

What psi did you set the power bleeder to?

[Ian Rogers]

Yes i used brake cleaner and a clean rag on the rotors and pads. I ran the bleeder at 15 PSI on my C02 tank.

[MTL_4runner]

Yes i used brake cleaner and a clean rag on the rotors and pads. I ran the bleeder at 15 PSI on my C02 tank.


Do you have ceramic pads?

If not then I think you're right and the pads just haven't bedded completely yet.

[Speedy]

Anyone know if these 199mm calipers will fit with the Ivan Stewart TRD 16" Wheels? If so I guess I need to go this way as well when it's time for a brake job. I think I'll paint my calipers high gloss red!

[MTL_4runner]

Anyone know if these 199mm calipers will fit with the Ivan Stewart TRD 16" Wheels? If so I guess I need to go this way as well when it's time for a brake job. I think I'll paint my calipers high gloss red!


Speedy, I'd be shocked if they didn't fit but you could always "rent" one from a local auto parts store and check the clearance with the rim in place. I know even the 231mm calipers will fit most of the 16" wheels so I'd be quite surprised if the 199mm ones didn't work for you.

[Rock Slide]

Anyone know if these 199mm calipers will fit with the Ivan Stewart TRD 16" Wheels? If so I guess I need to go this way as well when it's time for a brake job. I think I'll paint my calipers high gloss red!


Speedy, you beat me to it! I plan to powder coat mine either a bright red, silver or black. Still undecided on which color to choose, but they will be pc'd. :D

[Rock Slide]

Speedy, I'd be shocked if they didn't fit but you could always "rent" one from a local auto parts store and check the clearance with the rim in place. I know even the 231mm calipers will fit most of the 16" wheels so I'd be quite surprised if the 199mm ones didn't work for you.


Jamie, that's a good idea on the "renting". I've been told the 199s fit on the Iv St wheels, but I'd like to know for sure as well.

Say the 231s even fit on these wheels w/o major grinding...is there any reason why I should get the 199s instead? Would I just be better off getting the 231s if they fit okay?

[MTL_4runner]

Say the 231s even fit on these wheels w/o major grinding...is there any reason why I should get the 199s instead? Would I just be better off getting the 231s if they fit okay?


I think between those two it's whatever makes you feel good with minimal aggravation. Both should get the job done for you, but if you do alot of towing then obviously fit the biggest caliper you can behind your rims.

[Rock Slide]

Gotcha. Thanks for the clarification.

[Chaplain]

Even I was able to perform this upgrade. A true no brainer and worth every pennie. My 16" tundra star wheels cleared the calipers fine without any rub.

Just had my 1st emergency stop for a big cow down in baja. Brakes worked perfect.....or was that an angle that stopped my truck. Green stuff pads and many prayers.... either way I stopped.

http://a196.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/112/l_9a476a4a73c5102d379fa167a9a4c4ab.jpg

[Rock Slide]

I'm getting this mod done this weekend...can't wait! :D

[Rock Slide]

Anyone know if these 199mm calipers will fit with the Ivan Stewart TRD 16" Wheels? If so I guess I need to go this way as well when it's time for a brake job. I think I'll paint my calipers high gloss red!


They fit perfect on the TRD IS wheels...no grinding what so ever. Even got mine PC'd in high gloss red too! :tongueout:

[Seanz0rz]

any one do this mod with AR steel wheels like the ones i have? im concerned about the fit against the caliper, as it looks like the caliper comes out a bit from the face of the hub.

[Rock Slide]

Got around to upgrading my stock brakes to Tundra Rotors, Calipers and Pads. Installed a set of Goodridge SS Braided Brake Lines too. Even powder coated the new calipers High Gloss Red :D:


http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i60/Fastluck/Tundra%20Brake%20Upgrade/Caliper2.jpg
http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i60/Fastluck/Tundra%20Brake%20Upgrade/CIMG0900.jpg
http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i60/Fastluck/Tundra%20Brake%20Upgrade/CIMG0899.jpg
http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i60/Fastluck/Tundra%20Brake%20Upgrade/CIMG0908.jpg


A big thanks to WabFab Off Road for all their help! :clap:

[jjrgr21]

i'm using the stock spare steel 16" wheels, so this is doable even if i have to grind a bit. right

[MTL_4runner]

Got around to upgrading my stock brakes to Tundra Rotors, Calipers and Pads. Installed a set of Goodridge SS Braided Brake Lines too. Even powder coated the new calipers High Gloss Red :D:

A big thanks to WabFab Off Road for all their help! :clap:


Wow, that looks nice.

So how's the braking now? :D

[Rock Slide]

Wow, that looks nice.

So how's the braking now? :D


Much better now. Granted, my stock brakes were going downhill quick, so I'm sure anything I slapped on there would have been an improvement. I am glad I went with the Tundras though. They sould last quite a long time...especially against my sometimes wreckless driving habits. :D

[Seanz0rz]

my rotors and pads are on their way, brembo and hawk respectively, and ill drop by autozone or napa this morning to find calipers.

question, should i buy calipers? or semi loaded calipers? difference being the semi loaded some with "hardware"

[MTL_4runner]

question, should i buy calipers? or semi loaded calipers? difference being the semi loaded some with "hardware"

Depends on the price caliper + hardware kit vs semi-loaded.
Buy whatever gets you everything you need in the most cost effective manner.

[Seanz0rz]

ok got the calipers, hopefully the guy behind the counter didnt screw it up, i gave him all the info i had on them. should get them tomorrow, and my rotors and pads monday, so im on track for a tuesday install, that if everything pans out like it should.

[4RunAmok]

My rotors arrived on Friday. Still deciding if I want to buy the rotors from a junkyark, Toyota dealer, or get remanufactured.

Has anyone tried A1 Cardone remanufactured calipers? The website I found them on sells both castings for $76.

They show a core price of $64.10. Does that mean I get $64.10 back (meaning I paid about $12 for the calipers) or do they add on $64.10 if I don't return the old Calipers?

[Seanz0rz]

well ups is slow, so looks like im getting my rotors and pads on thrusday, ill pick up my calipers tomorrow, and do a test fit.

i really wish someone could chime in on the compatibility of my black steel wheels and the tundra calipers.

[MTL_4runner]

Does that mean I get $64.10 back (meaning I paid about $12 for the calipers) or do they add on $64.10 if I don't return the old Calipers?


It's not the $12 option, I can tell you that.


Hint: second answer

[Seanz0rz]

ok so question: how much of the caliper can i actually grind off safely? pretty sure they are not going to fit sans modification with my steel wheels, but how much can i take the metal down before i start to go into the fluid passage?

my current wheels are about 1/4 inch away from the stock 4runner caliper.

[MTL_4runner]

I don't think I'd feel good taking off much more than 1/8" unless it was on a rib boss.

[Seanz0rz]

ok, mod all done! got out there at 8am this morning to beat the rain, and finished it by 1030. by far the longest part of this was the grinding on the caliper, a little bit at a time to avoid grinding off too much. i also touched my flap wheel to the back side of the wheel where it was touching, less than 1/16 of an inch removed, and probably alot less than that.

brakes are bled, but the pedal just feels a tad soft, so ill probably rebleed after it pours rain for 4 days. also, i have quite a bit of pedal travel before the brakes engage, this is a rear drum problem correct?

[MTL_4runner]

brakes are bled, but the pedal just feels a tad soft, so ill probably rebleed after it pours rain for 4 days. also, i have quite a bit of pedal travel before the brakes engage, this is a rear drum problem correct?


Use the homemade power bleeder if you have access to a compressed air source.
It will help alot with your currently mushy pedal.

[Rock Slide]

Seanz0rz, don't fret, mine where soft too after they were first bled. A few days of driving though and now the pedal is nice and tight!

[4LowLocked]

Thank you very much everyone for all the great info in this thread.

One quick question. Is the S13WE casting number the 199mm and the S13WL the larger 231?

[MTL_4runner]

One quick question. Is the S13WE casting number the 199mm and the S13WL the larger 231mm?


No, it's 13WL not S13WL, but otherwise you are correct.

[Seanz0rz]

actually ive found that the larger 231mm caliper has a casting number of 13wl, with no S at the front of it.

[MTL_4runner]

actually ive found that the larger 231mm caliper has a casting number of 13wl, with no S at the front of it.


Yes, you're right, I read it too fast.
My answer got corrected above.

[4RunAmok]

I did mine this last weekend. What an incredible difference.

The Calipers I bought were from Centrix remanfacturers. What a bunch of schmucks that place must be filled with, because they included the brake pad pins from a 4runner (1/4 TOO SHORT!!!) with the Tundra calipers.

I drove to 5 different locations in Souther California to finally purchase all 4 pins. Ended up having to buy them at 3 different Toyota dealers parts counters on a Saturday while my truck sat in pieces at my friends shop. Why Toyota sells these pins as single items when you'd think they'd be bought in pairs.

2 Junk yards refused to seperate them from the calipers
Toyota of North Hollywood had 2 pins.
Hamer Toyota in Mission Hills had 1 pin.
Keyes Toyota in Van Nuys had 1 pin.

But I got it together easy.

Two things I noticed:
I have the 5 spoke rims, and they did not rub on the calipers.
My dust shield did not require any trimming to fit the caliper, only minor pushing back to prevent rubbing the rotor. It made a horrible scraping noise without doing so. A little mallet on ball-peen and that was taken care of.

You can read the full story here: http://www.4wdtrips.net/forum/showthread.php?t=4936

[Seanz0rz]

well last week i found a leak on my left caliper, coming from where the two halves meet at the top. noticed a nice puddle in my wheel... glad i caught it when i did.

took it off, had napa replace it, when i got the replacement tuesday, correct part number, correct box, caliper was stamped with a big R, DAMN. so they reordered, came in today, same thing, so they called around and for sure got me one, hopefully its right.

the leaky caliper would definitely explain the less than stellar pedal feel and the slight pulling to the right. it will all be fixed friday afternoon/evening.

[MTL_4runner]

well last week i found a leak on my left caliper, coming from where the two halves meet at the top. noticed a nice puddle in my wheel... glad i caught it when i did.

took it off, had napa replace it, when i got the replacement tuesday, correct part number, correct box, caliper was stamped with a big R, DAMN. so they reordered, came in today, same thing, so they called around and for sure got me one, hopefully its right.

the leaky caliper would definitely explain the less than stellar pedal feel and the slight pulling to the right. it will all be fixed friday afternoon/evening.



Wow, good thing you caught that!
I am almost positive it will fix your issues.

[4RunAmok]

RE-PROPORTIONING???

Either I messed up the bleeding, or the rears feel like they don't do much anymore.

Stepping on the brakes, the front takes quite a dip now, and when the stop is complete, the front jumps back up to normal. Is this routine after this brake upgrade? Or did I miss something.

Someone I know had mentioned that I should get the proportioning valve adjusted, with the larger pistons (more volume of fluid) in the front, it will need to be adjusted.

BTW, Jamie, based on your signature, I got the auterra too. I LOVE it. Thanks!

[MTL_4runner]

RE-PROPORTIONING???

Either I messed up the bleeding, or the rears feel like they don't do much anymore.

Stepping on the brakes, the front takes quite a dip now, and when the stop is complete, the front jumps back up to normal. Is this routine after this brake upgrade? Or did I miss something.

Someone I know had mentioned that I should get the proportioning valve adjusted, with the larger pistons (more volume of fluid) in the front, it will need to be adjusted.

BTW, Jamie, based on your signature, I got the auterra too. I LOVE it. Thanks!


Glad you like the Auterra. :thumbup:

Something is not right if the front is diving as much as you say.
Are the rears properly adjusted? How many clicks to engage the e-brake?

A porportioning valve should not be required for the mod.
......only if you swap over to rear disc brakes (not recommended).

[Seanz0rz]

i second adjusting the rears. mine dips but not that bad. im also kind of easy on the brakes though.

[Rock Slide]

4RunAmok, how many days has it been since you did the upgrade? Was it recent or has the issue you're having been going on for a while?

My pedal was a little soft too the first couple days after the mod was completed, but since then, the pedal has a nice tight feel to it.

[4RunAmok]

It's been awhile now. At least 2 months.

I just upgraded the suspension this last weekend. I put King coil-overs in the front, and it still does the dipping thing if I get on the brakes good. I've already had the dealer adjust the brakes and re-bleed them. They took that as FLUSH brake fluid when my g/f tried to explain that I wanted the brakes bled. Massive upgrade cost there.

It helped, but not much the e-brake feels better, but no long-lasting effect to stop the front from dipping.

I think I'm going to have the re-proportioning done, at least have it checked.

[YotaFun]

I am curious how much can you gring off the calipers?
The Micky Thompson Classic II Rims with 4-7/16 back spacing just touch my current calipers.
(not mounted just was test fitted, and when the rubbing was found, there were nw words from my mouth that even my best friends hasn't heard out of it....)

I would like to save money in the long run and not have to sell these rims and buy others.
So an idea of how much I could take off would be a great help!

other than that clearence is great on those MTs....

[hillbilly]

I just did this last night. Because I have PC'd LC wheels, I had to take off a fair amount. Probably a .25" off the rib boss and somewhere around an .125" from the back of the piston housing (Raybestos reman S13WE calipers).


:drink:

[Seanz0rz]

i probably did the same.

[YotaFun]

So that's how much you took off, my question is, is that the max or can you take off more?

[hillbilly]

I'd consider MTL's comments close to gospel:
http://www.ultimateyota.com/index.php?option=com_smf&Itemid=26&topic=54.msg33849#msg33849

Now that I've done it, I have to agree. Much more than an 1/8" on the back of the piston housing and I'd be concerned of weakening/leaking.

[YotaFun]

I really should clarify my postings more cause that was the exact answer i was looking for Hillbilly.

Thanks!

[thmpr]

Have read the entire thread and great info by the way. As I searched for the calipers, there are a few brands available. So my question is "Which brands are people leaning towards more?" Fenco or Beck Arnley?

[thmpr]

Jumped on the Tundra brake upgrade. Found used original 2001 Tundra calipers ($150.00 for both) and bought the caliper rebuild kit from my dealer for $10 which is is for both sides. Ordered the slotted Brembo rotors and Hawk LTS pads. The only thing left is the brake lines.


Calipers: $165.00 (shipping included)
Rotors and Pads: $240.00
Caliper Rebuild kit: $10.00

Total: $415.00

I was thinking of getting the remanf. calipers from my local auto parts but opted for Original parts.

[Seanz0rz]

out of that total, subtract the cost of rotors and pads, since you probably needed new ones anyway, esp since the stock rotors warp like LP's in an oven.

[MTL_4runner]

esp since the stock rotors warp like LP's in an oven.


:laugh: .....good analogy.

[bamachem]

don't forget that you can put the rims on, spin them around so that they contact the caliper, in effect marking where you can clearance the wheels just a tad along w/ clearancing the caliper ribs...

[YotaFun]

Now I was thinking about this today going down the road
(kinda hit my like when that dodge hit Tess)

For those of you with the LC rims that had to shave a little off after the Swap,
I presume with the normal Runner Calipers you didn't need to shave.

If so then the Tundra calipers would be bigger on the outside then the 4Runner ones correct?
Not just the inner void.

[hillbilly]

For those of you with the LC rims that had to shave a little off after the Swap,
I presume with the normal Runner Calipers you didn't need to shave.Correct. I've run LC wheels for about a year with stock calipers and had no clearance issues.


If so then the Tundra calipers would be bigger on the outside then the 4Runner ones correct? Not just the inner void.
I installed the Tundra rotors/calipers last Sunday evening and ran into caliper clearance problems when I test fitted the LC wheels. It was tight enough the LCs wouldn't even spin. (Mine are probably a bit tighter than most since my LCs have been PC'd.) So, I had to grind ~1/4" off the upper rib boss and ~1/8" off the inside corner of piston housing.

FYI: I used Raybestos reman'd calipers (RC11039/40). Not sure if other brands may fit better or worse.

[97kurt]

Using factory tundra calipers (199mm) and a set of 94-97 Land cruiser rims I also had to do some triming today to make the rims work. Using a 60 grit flap disc it took under 5 min per side to reduce/slim down the upper rib. Then area around the piston got smoothed out.

Luckily I had a spare unmounted 5th rim to do the test fitting with.

[thmpr]

Completed my retro over a week ago and all I can say is..... I wished I knew about this upgrade when I first bought my 4runner!!!! The stopping power between stock and the Tundra has no comparison. If your on the sideline thinking if you should do this upgrade.... Just do it! You won't be dissapointed.

[JHRRLD]

I did the upgrade about three weeks ago along with installing the SS 7.2 kit and changing out my CV axles. Talk about a fun job. Damn is all I can say the brakes are awesome! :clap:

Now here is my question. I just got my LX 450 wheels back from the powder coater. I'm going to clearance them before I have my new tires mounted. Did you guys take any precautions when grinding away material from the caliper? For example did you cover up the rotor as much as possible or take the caliper off the vehicle?

Or am I being an :asshat: thinking that those little shards of metal could mess up my pretty new brembo rotors? :hillbill:

Thanks,

Josh

[hillbilly]

Did you guys take any precautions when grinding away material from the caliper? For example did you cover up the rotor as much as possible or take the caliper off the vehicle?

Or am I being an :asshat: thinking that those little shards of metal could mess up my pretty new brembo rotors? :hillbill:

Thanks,

Josh
You could be an :asshat:, but not for being worried about ruining your brand new brakes. :laugh:

The metal shavings won't "mess up" your new rotors as much as they could potentially damage your new calipers. I threw a rag over the top of the calipers while grinding to keep any shavings from falling down into the pad/piston area of the calipers. Once the grinding was done, I flooded the exposed rotor/caliper areas with brake cleaner and wiped everything down with 2nd rag. Then turn the rotor enough to clean the rotor area hidden behind the caliper and you should be good.

HTTH.

[JHRRLD]

Did you guys take any precautions when grinding away material from the caliper? For example did you cover up the rotor as much as possible or take the caliper off the vehicle?

Or am I being an :asshat: thinking that those little shards of metal could mess up my pretty new brembo rotors? :hillbill:

Thanks,

Josh
You could be an :asshat:, but not for being worried about ruining your brand new brakes. :laugh:

The metal shavings won't "mess up" your new rotors as much as they could potentially damage your new calipers. I threw a rag over the top of the calipers while grinding to keep any shavings from falling down into the pad/piston area of the calipers. Once the grinding was done, I flooded the exposed rotor/caliper areas with brake cleaner and wiped everything down with 2nd rag. Then turn the rotor enough to clean the rotor area hidden behind the caliper and you should be good.

HTTH.


Cool, thanks. Did you end up having to clearance your PC'd LC rims too?

[hillbilly]

Nope. Shaving the calipers was enough to get my PC'd LCs to clear...

[Nick]

Very basic question concerning buying reman'ed calipers:

Is there much of a difference between 'em? I don't figure there could be but, to illustrate my point:

CARDONE Unloaded S13WE (one) : $85 + $50 core.
Raybestos Unloaded S13WE (one): $95 + $30 core
Fenco Unloaded S13WE (one) : $96 + $50 core

This info taken from two different sites ( autozone+partsamerica)

I'm thinking of going with the cheapest one and calling it a day. Would I be right in doing so?

[4LowLocked]

Just did this over the weekend and LOVE it. Braking feels so much stronger now. I did run into a prob with one of the reman calipers - where one of the pins had been air chiseled out. during the rebuild, it looks as though they tried welding it and we didnt notice until they were on. As we started bleeding the brakes, fluid started gushing out. So the truck sat on the jack for 2 days until a new caliper arrived

Just make sure to inspect the calipers prior to starting the install

[2ndGen]

i've gotta do this mod!! more i read this thread, more i feel the need of bigger brakes.

few questions:
a.) i want to start looking for junkyard calipers first, what do i need to ask? as in what model/year, V6 or V8, 2WD or 4WD, etc.
b.) i want to do a brake fluid flush while i'm at it, what'd be the best fluid for that? traditional or sythentic, DOT3 or power steering fluid.
c.) i'm thinking about replace the stock brake lines to SS line, will it worth the extra money and time?
d.) OEM pads or Hawk
e.) OEM rotors or Brembo


thanks.

[YotaFun]

2nd Gen, I can answer your last 3 questions, or at least give you my .02
I would upgrade the brake lines, mine need to be replaced I think and probably wouldn't hurt to do it.
A lot of guys here have just gone OEM on the pads, probably will be fine for the upgraded setup, as for the Hawk, my friend is running them on his stock set up and couldn't be happier, i think its more a preference on money...
Brembo rotors, A friend of mine with a Tundra has them and he has not had an issues with them at all, I just think the OEM stink, at least on the runners...

[YotaFun]

Soemthing Tells me I got the wrong calipers....
I think I may have gotten the slightly bigger ones....

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a2/Nighthief/4Runner/DSC03940.jpg
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a2/Nighthief/4Runner/DSC03939.jpg

Some one care to enlighten me lol!
I am thinking my deal wasn't so much of a deal anymore...

[YotaFun]

Well If numb nuts here (points to self and slaps self on head) reads, I have figured out that I have the 231mm calipers.
Which I guess I can be happy for since I will be flat towing another rig behind me.
Now Just got to get some brake caliper Paint and get those things coated in red to match the suspension and install.

The guy that sold them to me even had pads already in them!
I got a full packaged deal for 130 Shipped!

[2ndGen]

will your wheels fit over these larger calipers? dust cover, spindle?

[YotaFun]

They should according to others, when I get home tonight I am going to fit the caliper on to see.
I thing all I am going to have to do is trim the dust shield a bit.

And I just found out at the 231mm calipers where part of a TPS for the tundra's so I don't know what that would really mean for us.

[YotaFun]

Okay now I need a little more help
Which one is left and which one is right?

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a2/Nighthief/4Runner/DSC03942.jpg
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a2/Nighthief/4Runner/DSC03941.jpg

[hillbilly]

Dude. :asshat: Its pretty simply. The brake line fittings won't line up if you mount them on the wrong side. :D

[YotaFun]

Dude. :asshat: Its pretty simply. The brake line fittings won't line up if you mount them on the wrong side. :D


Yeah you know I kinda figured that when I woke up this morning...
I guess I was so excited to get them I just didn't think, what else is new...

[hillbilly]

You've would figure it out, but I had to get a friendly :prod: in... :hillbill:

[YotaFun]

Alright, before I burn a hole in my pocket buying 10 cans of brake parts cleaner, can someone suggest an easier way of cleaning these things off?
I want to paint them, but that is looking to be easier said then done...

This is how far I got with a wire brush and a full can of cleaner:
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a2/Nighthief/4Runner/DSC03943.jpg
This is what they looked like when I got them:
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a2/Nighthief/4Runner/DSC03944.jpg

I also think I found a potential future problem....:
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a2/Nighthief/4Runner/DSC03945.jpg

[YotaFun]

Alright I have an issue.
One of the calipers will have to be replaces since the bleeder broke off
(don't ask...)

Also how hard is it to rebuild a caliper.
The other caliper is going to need it...

[RunnerUp]

okay, so my front brakes are toast and i am trying to get the parts together this week before i move.... so i need some help.

okay, so i know i got to go to autozone to get the calipers, my question is in regards to the rotors. i followed a link to 4wdtrips.com and the link they posted was for 2002 Tacoma 4wd Ext Cab rotors for 49.00 a piece plus shipping. when i searched EVERY single tundra rotor, not only was it a different part number, but the price had jumped up to 75 a piece plus shipping... which do i get?

[RunnerUp]

edit* rotors were for a 2002 Tacoma 4wd Reg. Cab

[bamachem]

with Tundra calipers, you MUST use Tundra pads AND Tundra rotors.

[RunnerUp]

so has the price really jumped to 75$ a rotor since you guys did this? seems excessive, but i guess it is what it is right?

[RunnerUp]

ugh, whatever, i just ordered the rotors from tirerack for 75$ a piece... oh well, better that than continue to warp stock rotors i guess...

[YotaFun]

At least your not spending money on calpers you just bought and getting something new :-)

[RunnerUp]

haha, i suppose, always gotta look at the bright side.

on a side note, ive heard people complain about these rotors rusting fairly quickly, anyone experience that with our trucks?

[bamachem]

i had no issues, but i had brembo blanks...

[RunnerUp]

these are the ones i ordered

http://www.tirerack.com/brakes/brakes.jsp?&make=Brembo&model=Replacement+Rotor&group=Replacement+Rotor&autoMake=Toyota&autoModel=Tundra+SR5+4wd&autoYear=2002&autoModClar=&perfCode=P

[2ndGen]

talk about rotors, what about this:

http://www.toyotacatalog.net/M1WebGear/partimages/CDROTORS6.JPG

http://www.toyotacatalog.net/M1WebGear/ProductDetails.aspx?PartUniqueID=782631D2-C89B-41AC-BA29-0575F867B0BE

Tundra (99-04) Cross Drilled/sloted Rotors 3.4L & 4.7L

there is a group buy on custom taco's

http://www.customtacos.com/forum/showthread.php?s=10397fe115f5694f3ad1c1e3c4291e8f&t=116128

are they any good?

[YotaFun]

I would stick with blanks or just slotted rotors.
I have heard of issues with drilled rotors cracking...

Once I get my calipers rebuilt and fixed I will tell you hpw the slotted rotors I have are :D

[bamachem]

these are the ones i ordered

http://www.tirerack.com/brakes/brakes.jsp?&make=Brembo&model=Replacement+Rotor&group=Replacement+Rotor&autoMake=Toyota&autoModel=Tundra+SR5+4wd&autoYear=2002&autoModClar=&perfCode=P




that's the ones that i had. they were good...

[RunnerUp]

alright sweet! now i just gotta order the calipers and pads and spend an afternoon drinking some cold ones and installing the new parts!!

side note

i wonder how my rear disc conversion is going to behave with the new brakes up front...

[RunnerUp]

okay, so i am interested to know how all of you guys are breaking in the new brakes? on tirerack.com it says to drive between 60-30mph and apply the brakes, drive for 1/2 mile to let them cool and then repeat... 30 times!! is that right?

next week is going to be freaking sweet! not only do i get my rotors in today, but hopefully my warrantied lightforces back by the end of this week/beginning of next, but i also get my new rear control arms on monday! so i am going to have one VERY full day of wrenching!

[mastacox]

Posted this on TOF once upon a time...

StopTech instructions for seating pads A.K.A. breaking in brakes-




Breaking in rotors and pads is critical to the optimum performance of your new brakes. When breaking in new parts, you are not only heat cycling the pads, but depositing a layer of pad material onto the rotor face as well. If not broken in properly, an uneven layer of pad material will be deposited onto the rotor causing vibration.

Virtually every instance of a "warped rotor" is attributed to uneven pad deposition.

Typically, a heavy braking street driver will experience approximately 1 to 1.1G’s of deceleration. At this rate, ABS will be activated on such equipped vehicles. A moderate braking effort is needed to properly break in rotors and pads. A stopping force of approximately 70-80%, just short of ABS intervention or lock-up is a general estimate of pedal effort you are trying to achieve.

Note: Plated lated rotors must be driven with gentle braking until CAD plating is worn off rotor faces BEFORE starting the break-in procedure. Do not use brakes aggressively until plating is worn off, typically several miles of driving.

FAILURE TO READ, UNDERSTAND AND AND FOLLOW THESE PROCEDURES WILL CAUSE PERMANANT DAMAGE TO YOUR BRAKE ROTORS AND KEEP THE SYSTEM FROM WORKING AT IT’S FULL CAPACITY.

Rotor and Pad Break-in (continued)

After completeing installation, make a series of 10 stops from 60 to 5-10 miles per hour. At the end of each stop, immediately accelerate to 60 again for the next stop. Run all stops in one cycle. During the 60 to 5-10 MPH series of stops, the exact speed is not critical. Accelerate to appoximately 60 and begin the braking cycle. As you approach 5-10 MPH, it is not necessary to watch the speedometer, keep your eyes on the road and approximate your speed at the end of each cycle. After the final stop of each cycle, drive as much as possible without using the brakes to cool off the system. Ideally, the brakes should be allowed to cool to ambient temperature before using again.

DO NOT COME TO A COMPLETE STOP, AS YOU WILL IMPRINT PAD MATERIAL ONTO THE ROTOR, CAUSING A VIBRATION.

There are several indicators to look for while breaking in the system:

On the 8th ot 9th stop, there should be a distinct smell from the brakes. Smoke may be evident after several stops as well. Also on the 8th or 9th stop, some friction materials will experience “green fade”. This is a slight fading of the brakes. The fade will stabilize, but not completely go away until the brakes have cooled.

After the break-in cycle is finished, there will be a blue tint color on the rotor with a light gray film on the rotor face. The blue tint indicates the rotor has reached the proper break in temperature and the gray film is pad material starting to transfer onto the rotor face.

If racing or higher performance pads are being used, add four stops from 80 to 5-10mph and if a full race pad, four stops from 100 to 5-10 miles per hour.

After the first break in cycle shown above, the brakes will still not be operating at their best capacity capacity. A second or third bed-in cycle is typically necessary before the brakes really start to “come in”. A “cycle” is a series of stops with a cool down in between each cycle.

StopTech does not endorse speeding on public roads. If going above the legal speed limit, do so in a safe area, away from traffic at your own risk.


Big Brake kit for Tundra/Sequoia PDF (http://8.7.96.35/tech_info/manuals_bbk/Toyota_Sequoia%20_and_Tundra%20Installation_98-856-1460_Rev%20B_01-09-03.pdf)

[RunnerUp]

okay so.... day two and i am now officially pissed off at my truck and advanced auto parts.

i got the old calipers and roters off no problem, easy as pie, i install everything no problem, EXCEPT the freaking brake line on the passenger side, i got it tight except brake fluid is shooting out from inside, not on the sides, from inside the threaded nut, so im pretty sure i got a bad caliper, and of course i HAD to strip the 10mm because i kept thinking it just wasnt on tight enough.

went back to advanced to get new brake lines and they sold me the cheapest POS tube bender which was useless and so now i have to go BACK and get more brake line and the replacement caliper.

i love how the simplest jobs can turn into a 3 day cluster____ of smashing knuckles and rounding off bolts... okay, vent off... now i need nice cold brew and watch some mindless tv for the rest of the night

oh, and if any of you guys have any helpful hints plese feel free to throw them my way!

[YotaFun]

okay so.... day two and i am now officially pissed off at my truck and advanced auto parts.

i got the old calipers and roters off no problem, easy as pie, i install everything no problem, EXCEPT the freaking brake line on the passenger side, i got it tight except brake fluid is shooting out from inside, not on the sides, from inside the threaded nut, so im pretty sure i got a bad caliper, and of course i HAD to strip the 10mm because i kept thinking it just wasnt on tight enough.

went back to advanced to get new brake lines and they sold me the cheapest POS tube bender which was useless and so now i have to go BACK and get more brake line and the replacement caliper.

i love how the simplest jobs can turn into a 3 day cluster____ of smashing knuckles and rounding off bolts... okay, vent off... now i need nice cold brew and watch some mindless tv for the rest of the night

oh, and if any of you guys have any helpful hints plese feel free to throw them my way!


You couldn't pull the lines off the wrecked 97 for the time being?

[RunnerUp]

already did that... stripped those also

[YotaFun]

already did that... stripped those also


EWWW that sucks!

[Seanz0rz]

yea those nuts are VERY soft...

ive found an adjustable wrench to be better, because you can REALLY snug it up tight on the nut, and they are usually wider to spread out the load.

[RunnerUp]

i was actually using my tube wrenches which fit almost all the way around the nut, so i was just getting more pissed about rounding them off. ill have to try the adjustable tomorrow after i get more lines.

[Seanz0rz]

oh wow if you were rounding them with line wrenches, you might want to try soaking in PB blaster first

[RunnerUp]

i was rounding them when i was reinstalling them, not taking them out, think i still need pb blaster?

[4runnerchevy]

Step back and take a deap breath. Something must be wrong, if your going through brake lines. I wouldn't pb blast before you put them on.

[2ndGen]

this is on my very next TO-DO list. i've got a pair of used calipers, here are some questions:

a.) since i have a lift, and the 4Runner is 10 years old, should i swap out the OEM brake lines with SS braided lines? what length?

b.) do i need to bleed all 5 points( 4 wheels + LSPV) even i'm only changing the front brakes.

[04 Rocko Taco]

In my personal opinion, yes, go ahead and go with the SS lines, you can get the ones from Trail gear, they are not exspensive, and some here, on UY, are even TG dealers. :) (PM me for info)

I have them on my '84, and they were a cinch to install.

When I bleed, I always go aheda and bleed all 5.

[YotaFun]

Remember 2ndGen,
The 3rd gen 4runner dosen't have that LPSV so all you need to do is bleeb all fours :-)

I hate the LPSV with a passion...

[RunnerUp]

got it done! it was a faulty caliper, just got done bleeding the brakes and now im going to go break them in!

[RunnerUp]

alright, so the brakes are on, and feel much stronger than the stockers, so this week while im free im going to pull the drum brakes off my 97 project truck and put them on my 02 so that i have an ebrake again!

im so happy i did this upgrade, worth every penny and all the frustration!

oh, and 4runnerchevy, thanks for saying that, that is EXACTLY what i needed to hear, i was getting a little hot headed over the whole thing. so thanks for grounding me again!

[RunnerUp]

dang, i totally forgot theres a tropical storm coming tomorrow... so that 86's the plan to swap back to drums tomorrow.... oh well

[2ndGen]

ok, i'm so gonna do this mod, i've got the used OEM calipers(199mm S13WE) taken apart last night, got them cleaned inside and out, all the internals are perfect no need for rebuild. Brembo rotors are on the way from tirerack. Cebby is checking the braided lines for me and Rafa is DA man for some OEM pads.

still one last question about the springs:

see the difference between these 2 pictures:

http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i60/Fastluck/Tundra%20Brake%20Upgrade/CIMG0899.jpg

http://4rnr.net/images/p5240411.jpg

in the second picture, there is an "anti-rattle spring"(i think that is what it's called), the top picture doesn't. which one is correct?

[04 Rocko Taco]

I've never looked at the Tundra Brakes, but for the life of me I cant figure out what that little spring does in the middle. The one on the inboard side of the caliper (1st pic) is the retainer spring for the pad pins.... but the other one (yellow in the second pic) I have no idea.....

and the big metal spring clamp looking thing from the second one is just a pad tensioner, supposed to help keep tension on the pads, and on the pad pins. I have run my brakes with and without them (on accident) and they seemed to do fine either way, if you have it, put it in there, if you don't, I wouldn't sweat it.

[Seanz0rz]

the middle spring i guess pushes the pads away from the rotor. maybe simply as an anti vibration device to keep the pads pushed against the pistons

[RunnerUp]

the remanned tundra calipers i used didnt come with that piece but my stock brakes did have it on there, so i put it on the tundra calipers and they seem to be working just fine by me

[2ndGen]

well, i found a Tundra FSM online, here is a screen shot of the caliper

http://i172.photobucket.com/albums/w38/tonniechengca/tundra-caliper-3.jpg

did anybody mention the anti-squeal shims? 4 per caliper?

[04 Rocko Taco]

I've also run my brakes without the shims, its better to have them, but whether you have them or not, just use some disc brake quiet goop on the back of the pads wherever they make contact with the pistons.

Also - Good find, looks like the Tundy brakes use that W shaped anti-rattle spring instead of the larger tacoma style anti rattle spring. Nice work.

[Rock Slide]

ok, i'm so gonna do this mod, i've got the used OEM calipers(199mm S13WE) taken apart last night, got them cleaned inside and out, all the internals are perfect no need for rebuild. Brembo rotors are on the way from tirerack. Cebby is checking the braided lines for me and Rafa is DA man for some OEM pads.

still one last question about the springs:

see the difference between these 2 pictures:

http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i60/Fastluck/Tundra%20Brake%20Upgrade/CIMG0899.jpg

http://4rnr.net/images/p5240411.jpg

in the second picture, there is an "anti-rattle spring"(i think that is what it's called), the top picture doesn't. which one is correct?



Both the 1st pic of my Red Caliper and the 2nd pic of another caliper have the "anti-rattle springs" in them. Mine was a silver spring, the 2nd pic contains a yellow one. Both are the same piece. However, I have always been told that theses springs should be run in the top section of the caliper in the shape of an "M" (like I've done in the 1st pic.) The anti-rattle spring in the 2nd pic is incorrect.

The long & straight metal clip running the length of the inner side of my caliper in the 1st pic, just keeps the 2 pins from falling out. It's amazing to think that one little piece holds everything together. Without it, the pins would slide out and the pads could then come out.

Also, that large metal clamp mounted on the caliper in the 2nd pic I believe is a pad tensioner. My reman calipers did not come with those, so that's why I am not running any. I have not had any issues w/o running these either.

As far as the shims, I've never run those on mine.

For SS braided brake lines, I went with: http://www.wheelersoffroad.com/96024runnerblines.htm

Hope this helps.

[Seanz0rz]

my partially loaded calipers from napa only came with the yellow spreader spring in those pics. my old 4runner calipers had the anti rattle clip (the big piece of stamped sheetmetal) but i did not reuse those.

[2ndGen]

i called Rafa@NTP minutes ago, he confirmed that factory Tundra breaks do NOT come with the sheet metal clips, only W pins.

[2ndGen]

ok, i got the brakes done this past weekend, all took about 1.5 hours, no grinding needed on the caliper as the 5-star limited rims cleared them with ease.

i would rank this mod as #1 for anybody owns a 3rd gen. no matter if yours is a street queen(king) or a crawler, bone stock or tricked out, it works, period.

after breaking in the pads and rotors i went to san diego visiting my brother, i helped him haul some dirt from a city yard, with 5 adults and 400lbs of dirt in the back, these tundra brakes worked just perfect, definitely an upgrade from the stock.

[Sled_Dog]

ok, i got the brakes done this past weekend, all took about 1.5 hours, no grinding needed on the caliper as the 5-star limited rims cleared them with ease.

i would rank this mod as #1 for anybody owns a 3rd gen. no matter if yours is a street queen(king) or a crawler, bone stock or tricked out, it works, period.

after breaking in the pads and rotors i went to san diego visiting my brother, i helped him haul some dirt from a city yard, with 5 adults and 400lbs of dirt in the back, these tundra brakes worked just perfect, definitely an upgrade from the stock.




2ndGen, Did you just use the Brembo rotors for $75 (At tirerack) for the 16" wheels? When I was browsing stock 4runner rotors I noticed they had 2 flavors and It gave me pause...

[2ndGen]

correct, the $75 rotor are it. pads were OEM i ordered through Rafa@NTP

one thing i want to mention, due to some glitches wiht FEDEX, pads from Rafa didn't arrive on time, i had to go to Longo Toyota to get a pair of the same pads. it costed me <$50 from Rafa shipped to my door, and $92 for me to pick up myself at Longo. so when Fedex dropped off the pads from Rafa, i returned them to Longo, no brainer.

[Sled_Dog]

Well looks like the newbie is next. Just bought these on eBay. Dude couldn't confirm casting number but I think I'm OK and they were a good price. NAPA wanted 80.00 + 82.00 Core and Autozone was about $10 less. Way too much for my taste considering I want to keep my 4Runner Calipers.

Take a look and see if I'm OK here...

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&item=260283652425

Raubestos part matched the number going around.

[Sled_Dog]

Well looks like the newbie is next. Just bought these on eBay. Dude couldn't confirm casting number but I think I'm OK and they were a good price. NAPA wanted 80.00 + 82.00 Core and Autozone was about $10 less. Way too much for my taste considering I want to keep my 4Runner Calipers.

Take a look and see if I'm OK here...

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&item=260283652425

Raybestos part matched the number going around.


Just got these today, casting number S13WE, looks like I got an OK deal, rebuilt Bendix calipers for about $64 each shipped with no core charge. They didn't include the W shaped anti-rattle spring. One of the pistins is slightly marred at the ends on the inside, the surface that will make contact with the pads looks OK and flush, to put it another way the inside of the "cup" is a little marred. Do you guys think that could be a problem?

Also I wanted to ask, I found a good deal on some new OEM Tundra rotors. Do these suffer the same warping issue as our 4Runner rotors? I'd rather do OEM as much as possible but if the Brembo's are better then that's what I'll go with.

Thanks for this thread and advice guys, this is super cool, I'm really getting charged up to do this!

[Seanz0rz]

the whole reason for the swap is the thicker tundra rotor. the diameter is not any larger than stock 4runner disks, but the disks are thicker, thus reducing the warping problem. the OEM rotors will be fine. i chose to go with brembo because they were just about the same price as OEM.

[MTL_4runner]

The Tundra rotors are so much better than stock that even the el cheapo house brand rotors will usually be fine (I'm running a no-name set myself). It's much more critical to have a good brand if you tow alot or are just using the stock brake setup.

[Flomaster]

*BUMP*
ok so im hooked on this mod my brakes on my 97 are complete shizzle! pedal has vibration when braking at certain speeds, the pedal has to be depressed at leas 35/40% before any braking occurs.
so get calipers from Napa or Auto zone.
get Rotors from TireRack.com http://www.tirerack.com/brakes/brakes.jsp?&make=Brembo&model=Replacement+Rotor&group=Replacement+Rotor&autoMake=Toyota&autoModel=Tundra+SR5+4wd&autoYear=2002&autoModClar=&perfCode=P
get pad from Toyota or Napa,Autozone does it make a difference?
should I replace my brake lines with SS one? if so can some one provide me with a link as to what lines I need to buy.

all in all this should run me about $400ish I presume..

EDIT: well im screwed I have a 15" wheel so I guess I am SOL on this mod :( this really chaps my hide as I dont feel my brakes are even safe in the condition they are in now and I would love to do this mod, however I can not afford new wheels/tires :(

[MTL_4runner]

*BUMP*
ok so im hooked on this mod my brakes on my 97 are complete shizzle! pedal has vibration when braking at certain speeds, the pedal has to be depressed at leas 35/40% before any braking occurs.
so get calipers from Napa or Auto zone.
get Rotors from TireRack.com
get pad from Toyota or Napa,Autozone does it make a difference?
should I replace my brake lines with SS one? if so can some one provide me with a link as to what lines I need to buy.

all in all this should run me about $400ish I presume..

EDIT: well im screwed I have a 15" wheel so I guess I am SOL on this mod :( this really chaps my hide as I dont feel my brakes are even safe in the condition they are in now and I would love to do this mod, however I can not afford new wheels/tires :(

Flowmaster, if you're short on cash and want to do the mod then get used parts from a boneyard and spend the rest of the cash to get 16" rims/tires off craigslist (then sell your old set to recoup some of the cash) which will fit. When I did the mod I bought used calipers ($50 set), house brand rotors ($30 ea), house brand pads ($20 set) and you don't need new SS lines or any of that stuff to make it functional. The sheer size of the brakes after the mod allow you use the cheaper parts and get away with it while the stock brakes you should be using the good stuff to prevent warping. The big barrier is that 16" rims and tires are a must have to do the mod.

[GSGALLANT]

Just thought I'd post up to say that the 231mm Tundra calipers (the larger ones found on the 2003+ Tundras and the ones that the TSB installs on the earlier Tundra's) fit with no caliper or wheel grinding on a 2002 4Runner with the stock 16" steel wheels. Read on...

Well, I tried the large (231mm) Tundra brake calipers and rotors on my 4Runner yesterday, and they fit with no grinding of the calipers or the wheels. Like all the other Tundra upgrade installs, I did have to trim the dust shield a bit above and below the caliper. Just thought I'd post up to try to keep as much info as possible about the different Tundra upgrade configurations in this thread. My 4Runner originally had the larger 4Runner brake package and stopped fine, but the rotors always warped soon after they were installed.

The specifics of my installation are as follows:

MY VEHICLE
2002 4Runner, V6, Auto, 4x4, with the Stock 16" Steel Wheels

MY "NEW" PARTS
Two remanufactured 2005 Tundra Calipers (13WL)
Two OEM 2005 Tundra Rotors (43512-0C011)
Akebono pads for 2005 Tundra from NAPA

The Tundra upgrade parts were bought used from my friend... he ran them on his 1999 Tacoma for the last 5 months. Not many miles were put on the truck in that time.

I took some fine grit sandpaper (180 grit) and lightly sanded the rotors to knock off the fine coating of pad material. I also lightly sanded the pad surfaces to remove the light glazing. Cleaned everything off with brake cleaner, installed the rotors, calipers and pads, bled the system, then off I went to re-bed the pads. After having bed the pads and done a bit of testing, I can only say WOW! Awesome mod.

The brakes on the 4Runner in my opinion had always stopped the truck very well, but the shuddering was very annoying. That is completely gone now, braking is very smooth, and the truck stops quicker than before.

As far as clearance with the steel wheels, it's not excessive, but there is approximately 3/32" between the wheel "spokes" and the edge of the caliper. There is plenty of clearance (same as stock) between the inside surface of the rim and the caliper.

[GSGALLANT]

I would also like to add that the steel wheel on my spare tire does not clear the new Tundra 231mm calipers, therefore if I have a flat on the front, I'll have to put the spare on the rear and move the rear tire to the front.

[GSGALLANT]

It depends... You may not be able to install Tundra brakes at all. 2nd gen and 3rd gen caliper bolting arrangements (spacing) are different. Tundra caliper bolt spacing is the same as 3rd gen 4Runners, but not 2nd gens. Not sure about your friend's '95 special release.

[tour4fun]

Does anyone know how the new Tundra calipers bolt on? I have larger wheels on my 1999 so I'm not worried about how large the caliper is. Anyone have a diagram of these calipers? :headscratch:

[Seanz0rz]

i very much doubt they would work. if you want the larger calipers, buy the 231mm models and trim the dust shield. i dont think it would be worth the extra time to engineer a solution to use the new tundra calipers.

[MTL_4runner]

Does anyone know how the new Tundra calipers bolt on? I have larger wheels on my 1999 so I'm not worried about how large the caliper is. Anyone have a diagram of these calipers? :headscratch:


That sounds like a major headache because they are significantly larger than the previous version and would require custom brackets to make work. I'd just bolt on the 231mm calipers as others have suggested.

[tour4fun]

That sounds like a major headache because they are significantly larger than the previous version and would require custom brackets to make work. I'd just bolt on the 231mm calipers as others have suggested.


Are these that different to the current 2 bolt bracket?

I currently have 355mm Stoptechs on, so I'm not worried about the size of the rotor. My concern is the bracket.

[xcmountain80]

i very much doubt they would work. if you want the larger calipers, buy the 231mm models and trim the dust shield. i dont think it would be worth the extra time to engineer a solution to use the new tundra calipers.


Unless perhaps you wanted the truck to indo and flip end over end, in that case I'm sure I could fab something up.

Aaron

[20005spd]

Does anyone know how the new Tundra calipers bolt on? I have larger wheels on my 1999 so I'm not worried about how large the caliper is. Anyone have a diagram of these calipers? :headscratch:
if your looking for more braking power than the tundra upgrade will offer you should do rear disk conversion and the tundra upgrade together.

[YotaFun]

Okay I got a situation folks.
Now that I get discounts I will be picking up a rebuild kit for my calipers.
However before I do so I need to tackle this little issue:
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a2/Nighthief/4Runner/Brakes/DSC04429.jpg
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a2/Nighthief/4Runner/Brakes/DSC04431.jpg
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a2/Nighthief/4Runner/Brakes/DSC04432.jpg

The Dumb (*&^ that sold me the calipers forgot to mention that one little thing wrong with them (probably why he took them off his truck to begin with.

So how would you all go about getting a broken bleeder out of a caliper?

[Seanz0rz]

go pick up a set of screw outs. be prepared to retap the caliper.

[CJM]

If he comes to my house sometime next week im gonna try and do it as nicely as possible but we may have to retap.

Im thinking ill drill a small pilot, try any number of extractors I have and well should worst come to worst we have no choice but to drill and retap. So long as i preserve the threads as much as possible we should be ok.

[wanna taco]

I did this mod on my 4runner yesterday...absolutely fantastic braking power now and best of all, no more warping :)

Thanks to everyone for the advice (especially MTL_4runner).

I bought (remanufactured) S13WE calipers, rotors and promax pads for a 2001 Tundra and the total bill after core return was $360.00 including tax in Mississauga, Ontario.

[SharpStick]

Yoters:

I did a piece on the 4Runner-Tundra brake swap that encompasses most of the tidbits of the project. It ran last month on off-road.com, and one that's a little different will be in 4WDTO next month. It's not 100% of the info, but you can get a pile of your answers there. It's really as easy as everyone says.

STICK

[MasterWIII]

Finally, no more warped 4Runner rotors! :clap: Definitely an easy, must do upgrade. I have a set of MKW 17" wheels and they fit perfectly without grinding (199mm). So pictures will be up after the usb cord arrives for the camera...

[Okie81]

I did this mod last weekend and thought I&#39;d contribute to an already great thread on this topic

I went with the S13we Calipers and the part numbers below:

Left loaded caliper = Raybestos RC11039
Right loaded caliper = Raybestos RC11040

FWIW, For the 231mm 13wl Calipers:
Left loaded caliper = Raybestos RC11549
Right loaded caliper = Raybestos RC11550



Just a couple notes:

1) To reaffirm, my 5 spoke alloys fit around the calipers with no problems or modifications :thumbup:

2) There was no modification required on my dust shield:

http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a125/joshuakin/P1010950.jpg
As you can see, It fit snug with no cutting or bending.

3) While unpacking/checking the parts I ordered online, I noticed that a couple bolts on the brake calipers were loose! :( So for safety sake, MAKE SURE ALL THE CALIPER BOLTS ARE SNUG, DON&#39;T ASSUME THEY&#39;RE TIGHT!!

If you&#39;re thinking about this upgrade, use this thread as your guide, it was a lot of help to me.

[Rock Slide]

Just curious Okie, what brand of rotors did you go with?

Nice work!

[Okie81]

Just curious Okie, what brand of rotors did you go with?

I went with Raybestos rotors as well, they have a standard rotor (#96939R), but I opted for the premium rotor (#96931). They cost a little more, but hopefully they'll hold up a little better/longer.

Thanks for all your info Rockslide, you had a few posts on YT that were very helpful to me as well.

[Rock Slide]

Glad I could help.

BTW, I like that they painted the hub portion of that rotor black. I tried doing that same look to mine w/ a can of spray paint, but the brake cleaner I used later that day, ate off all the spray paint. lol

[xcmountain80]

Oh oh I think I'm going to paint mine gold.............


A

[MikeKMitchell]

231 13WL Calipers: I'm not seeing any Raybestos calipers when I google. All I see are A1 Cardone and Fenco remanufactured. Raybestos better? Remanufactured OK?

Rotors: Brembo 25534 are ~$80 each. Duralast ~$76 each. PBR ~ $45 each. Opinions?

Pads: Dealer ~$92. Duralast ceramic ~$55. Duralast non-ceramic ~$37. Akebomo ceramic ~57. Comments?

[CJM]

Fenco is crap, A1 is crap, raybestos probably since its a pepboys brand can only be had there. Reman'd is usually ok, but new is better of course.

Try finding an advanced auto, they usually carry better stuff. If you can find some bendix or ac delco would be best or OEM rebuilding some off a junked truck or something.

I would go with brembo rotors for the price, forget any of those pads and go buy some hawk LTS and you will be happy.

[MTL_4runner]

231 13WL Calipers: I&#39;m not seeing any Raybestos calipers when I google. All I see are A1 Cardone and Fenco remanufactured. Raybestos better? Remanufactured OK?

Rotors: Brembo 25534 are ~$80 each. Duralast ~$76 each. PBR ~ $45 each. Opinions?

Pads: Dealer ~$92. Duralast ceramic ~$55. Duralast non-ceramic ~$37. Akebomo ceramic ~57. Comments?


For calipers I&#39;d definately stay away from Fenco and A1 Cardone, instead try to find Bendix, Raybestos, ACDELCO or get a used OEM set off a junked Tundra. You may also want to get loaded calipers (ie they come with the caliper, pads and brake hardware for the install).

For rotors I&#39;d go with Brembo, they are worth the money.

For pads (if you buy unloaded calipers) I&#39;d use Akebono Ceramic or Hawk LTS as suggested earlier.


You can also try www.rockauto.com (http://www.rockauto.com) for prices, I&#39;ve had good service from them in the past.

[Okie81]

x2 on Rock Auto, their prices are great and they accepted my old 4runner calipers for core. Loaded calipers will make the job easier too.

[mastacox]

So rather than start a new thread, I figured I&#39;d just post in here. I&#39;m going to need to do a front brake job pretty soon, so I figured I might as well start collecting parts for the Tundra upgrade. A few specific questions-

- Given that I have 17" wheels (and don&#39;t plan to ever go back) and .75" spacers, I can fit pretty much any brakes I like. Is there something else I should be looking at? I&#39;m wondering if I can get a better deal on a set of 231mm calipers, or if the 199&#39;s and the 231&#39;s are basically the same price. TundraSolutions has posts about a TSB which replaced the 199&#39;s with the 231&#39;s due to vibration, do any 4Runner guys with 199&#39;s have vibration problems? Are the 231&#39;s better? If there was a performance brake package for the Tundra in the $600 range, I would seriously consider it...

- I&#39;m looking at EBC USR7158 slotted rotors from Summit Racing (http://www.summitracing.com/parts/EBC-USR7158/), objections?

- Know of any place I can get loaded calipers with quality ceramic pads? What about semi-loaded so I can buy performance pads separately?

Thanks for the help.

[YotaFun]

I have the 231's, and I am satisfied with them,
I just need to get my rear brakes done so I don't keep eating through pads and rotors in the front.

My package I got off of e-bay cause the owner went with a Performance brake option for his Tundra that I think Rafa from Northridge was posting up here once.
Mine came with fully loaded calipers and slotted rotors.
I liked the rotors, granted I don't know the brand, but they seemed to preform well.
Next I will be going with brembo slotted rotors since brembo is a good name.

I had to replace one of the calipers due to bleed breaking off inside the caliper, and with my discount at advance, I got the semi-loaded caliper for $100 after core.

All said and done the final total for my swap was $300 ($200 for the original package which was a deal)

The brakes again have been working beautifully since then.

If you want, I have a set of calipers sitting around that I can go return for core for you and I can get you the bigger calipers semi-loaded, and then once you get them installed you can send me your old calipers (looking to possibly do a rear disk conversion in the future of the runner)

I just put hawk pads in stepdads 4runner and he has been thrilled with there performance as well as the brembo rotors, he is light on the brakes but when he is hard on them he's hard on them and no issues (and he is still running Stock 4Runner calipers.

Hope some of this makes sense

[CJM]

Personally speaking, a slotted or drilled rotor will not really do much imho. Our trucks dont generate enough braking heat to really take advantage of it. Course, I could be wrong, but imho brembo, AC Delco or bendix blanks should be fine.

As for pads, I highly recommend the hawk LTS pads. So far I have about 25k on mine with very little wear and despite the rear axle seal killing the one side of the rear shoes it still stops quite well.

[mastacox]

I have the 231's, and I am satisfied with them,
I just need to get my rear brakes done so I don't keep eating through pads and rotors in the front.


I didn't realize 231's fit in a 16" wheel, nice!



My package I got off of e-bay cause the owner went with a Performance brake option for his Tundra that I think Rafa from Northridge was posting up here once.
Mine came with fully loaded calipers and slotted rotors.
I liked the rotors, granted I don't know the brand, but they seemed to preform well.


Yeah I figured I'd buy a set of "new" (remanufactured) calipers, hadn't really found where yet though.



Next I will be going with brembo slotted rotors since brembo is a good name.


I want slotted too, to help retain braking power in wet conditions. Not drilled though because I hear they plug up with mud.



I had to replace one of the calipers due to bleed breaking off inside the caliper, and with my discount at advance, I got the semi-loaded caliper for $100 after core.

All said and done the final total for my swap was $300 ($200 for the original package which was a deal)

The brakes again have been working beautifully since then.


Dude that's a great deal, I'm budgeting $500 for the whole shebang...



If you want, I have a set of calipers sitting around that I can go return for core for you and I can get you the bigger calipers semi-loaded, and then once you get them installed you can send me your old calipers (looking to possibly do a rear disk conversion in the future of the runner)


I'm liking this idea, we should get in touch through PM in about a month when I've put away the moolah.



I just put hawk pads in stepdads 4runner and he has been thrilled with there performance as well as the brembo rotors, he is light on the brakes but when he is hard on them he's hard on them and no issues (and he is still running Stock 4Runner calipers.

Hope some of this makes sense

I'm looking for a performance ceramic pad, something like the Hawk or StopTech ceramics.

Thanks for the feedback!

[YotaFun]

Yup, I just had to shave the sides for my old 6 spoke rims, but my limited have plenty of room.

Yeah, "new" reman work, and yeah when your ready shoot me a PM and we can work it out.

I recommend Hawk Pads Myself

[Okie81]

Hey Brian, I went with the 199's because I heard that the spare tire may not fit the 231's (I never checked though...). Not a big deal I guess, but I didn't want to play musical tires if I ever got a flat. I have yet to hear any testimonial regarding the 231's being any better than the 199's. If you go with reman calipers, I highly recommend Raybestos from Rock Auto; they're the cheapest you'll find and their quality has been superb so far. There's also part #'s for semi-loaded as well

Here's the 199mm part #'s again:
Left loaded caliper = Raybestos RC11039
Right loaded caliper = Raybestos RC11040

FWIW, For the 231mm 13wl Calipers:
Left loaded caliper = Raybestos RC11549
Right loaded caliper = Raybestos RC11550

Even with reman. calipers, premium rotors and core charges, it was around $250 I think.

[97kurt]

I found some old pics when I was cleaning up my old laptop. So I updated the Tundra caliper re-build wiki and put some links in to the pictures. I cant remember if these pics ever got posted so here they are. If you have seen them before then :tongueout:

Rebuild thread:
http://www.ultimateyota.com/index.php?option=com_openwiki&Itemid=60&id=wiki:front_caliper_rebuild

Rotor differences
http://kurtandnichole.com/tundra_brakes/rotor_diff1.jpg
http://kurtandnichole.com/tundra_brakes/rotor_diff2.jpg

Caliper differences
http://kurtandnichole.com/tundra_brakes/caliper_diff1.jpg
http://kurtandnichole.com/tundra_brakes/caliper_diff2.jpg
(note the 16" limited calipers appear to be the close to the size as the 199s, but the tundras
allow for the larger rotor, if the tundras are bigger its not by much)

Before
http://kurtandnichole.com/tundra_brakes/before.jpg
After
http://kurtandnichole.com/tundra_brakes/after.jpg

[pillguy]

I was planning to go with a tundra upgrade on my 974runner, but decided against it. After doing some research, I ordered SS lines, carbon metallic pads (can get at Oreileys auto) and autozone rotors (lifetime). Friend of mine went with CM pads on hs LC-80 series and said the pads really make a big difference. I will keep you posted with results.

[YotaFun]

I don't think its as much of a pad issue as it is a rotor warp issues.
I installed stock brake pads and rotors on stepdads 4Runner and while it feels okay, it still could be an improvement, and next time his rotors start to warp I plan on doing the upgrade.

A friend of mine running a 98 with the same lift as me drove my truck for a week while I worked on his and he said its night and day difference and will be doing the swap himeself soon.

Do keep us posted, new finding are always great.

[Nick]

I'm pretty sure Eddie is right here...it's the rotor more-so then the pads. With my original 4Runner calipers, I used- Hawk HPS, Hawk Superduty, and OEM pads. After about 3,000 to 4,000 miles of NYC heavy stop and go, my rotors would warp, end of story.

I switched to the Tundra S13WE (199mm) calipers and Tundra rotors two winters ago. I have had zero problems since, towing or heavy traffic.

[coloredo]

I did the 199mm Tundra caliper (AdvanceAuto Cardone loaded, believe ) and new Brembo rotors (Tirerack) two years ago. The judder is back after about 24K miles - severe when towing a trailer in mountains, not so bad around town without trailer.

I was wondering if any suggestions? My plan is to grind (or replace) rotors and use Toyota pads.

[YotaFun]

Let off the brake a little....?

Lol just playing.
Thats interesting, I have gone roughly the same amount of miles with my Tundra calipers as well, Only cut the rotors once cause the pads worse away, and still no vibe issue.

Possible a caliper is sticking and causing excessive heat and the rotor to warp?
I couldn't really tell without looking at it, but a suggestion to look out for.

If the calipers are good, cut the rotors and get some nice pads and see how it goes from there

[xcmountain80]

I had my wheels off a few months back and noticed the driver side not spinning as freely as the pass. I immediately though the hubs were acting up, nope perhaps the locker, nope, hmmm the brake caliper? Yes as a matter of fact I noticed a bit of a shimmy the last few days, SO I pulled it and found a wet spot where 1 piston was seeping fluid and causing the pad to stick causing massive heat build up and uneven pad wear. I caliper was under warranty through Advanced Auto Parts, and since they didn't have the loaded calipers I got money back.

A

[Flexus]

Remember that the 213mm were issued because 199mm had vibration issues on the Tundra too. I'm not pointing fingers, just pointing it out.

If someone wants to go hog wild, try some 13WH calipers. They have even bigger rotors and come on the 17" wheel equiped 120s (FJC, 034R, GX). Supposedly people have squeezed them behind 16" wheels with some more grinding.

[YotaFun]

Yeah but the 213mm was just due because they where to small for the Tundra, but the 199mm are more the adequate for the 4Runner.

I have the 213mm and am happy, but I am sure I would be just as happy as if I had the 199mm

[MTL_4runner]

If someone wants to go hog wild, try some 13WH calipers.

I assume you meant the 13WL calipers.

[KZN185W]

The 13WH is on the 4th gen SE and those with 17" wheels, as well as on the GX470. the rotors for the 13WH caliper is 238mm diameter compared to the 13WL and 13WG 219mm diameter. the thickness of both rotors is the same, 28 mm. the pads are also the same. With a bigger diameter rotor, you got a bigger brake torque

[Dice Man]

I just bought the S13WE calipers gor my '98 4R, I'm getting the rotors this week, did you guys buy the new Tundra lugs since the Tundra bolts are 14.4mm and the stock 4R bolts are 14.6, not sure why the bigger rotors would have smaller lugs/bolts?

[YotaFun]

The Tundra rotors fit just fine over my lugs, beats me there bud

[griffin800]

I just bought the S13WE calipers gor my '98 4R, I'm getting the rotors this week, did you guys buy the new Tundra lugs since the Tundra bolts are 14.4mm and the stock 4R bolts are 14.6, not sure why the bigger rotors would have smaller lugs/bolts?


To help ease your mind, I did this upgrade a few years ago, and i did not need new lugs. I'll have to pull up receipts of what I put on there because I've had a lot of projects between then and now...

No vibrations, no wheels falling off... so, I'll assume no lug issues either :)

I got Napa Eclipse Calipers, Ate premium one rotors, and Hawk LTS pads... I also went to stainless steel brakelines when I did the work too.

Old rotors were warped and crap... obviously the upgrade to new parts was a huge improvement, but I can't say just how huge as i was replacing old stock parts...

Worth the effort tho surely.

I'll post photos soon

Good luck!