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Thread: Mosque near Ground Zero, what's your take?

  1. #1

    Mosque near Ground Zero, what's your take?

    I've seen some pretty heated discussions about this topic recently, I don't really want to get into what Obama said about it, but suffice it to say that he would have been far better of had he kept his trap shut, but his loss, not mine...

    Anyways, how do you feel about this?

    I personally believe that they have every right to build the mosque there, and that the government in no way should attempt to stop it, it sends us down a very dangerous road if they did.

    However, I do question not only the wisdom, but the intent of building it at that location. You'd have to not know about 9/11/2001 to think that building a mosque there wouldn't create any controversies, and since the developers were well aware of that date, you have to ask yourself, what were they thinking? Ultimately at the end of the day, regardless of what they were thinking, or what they are building it for, they do have the right to build it there. One thing it does show me is that, at least in this instance, these people have no concern for helping relations between Islam and the western world.
    Gone but not forgotten: 2004 Tacoma/2006 Fourwheel Camper<br /><br />ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ<br /><br />&quot;Tyrants mistrust the people, hence they deprive them of arms.&quot;<br />- Aristotle (384-322 B.C.)

  2. #2

    Re: Mosque near Ground Zero, what's your take?

    where exactly is it being built? some things ive read say within inches of ground zero. others say its blocks away.

    in either case dont mistake it as anything less then a military maneuver by the Islamic world. this is how they do business. its a sign of conquering a nation to erect a mosque on sacred ground.

    that said the agenda and the war is not what all Muslims are into its just that there is no separating military from religion in there way of life

  3. #3

    Re: Mosque near Ground Zero, what's your take?

    Quote Originally Posted by troyboy162
    where exactly is it being built? some things ive read say within inches of ground zero. others say its blocks away.

    in either case dont mistake it as anything less then a military maneuver by the Islamic world. this is how they do business. its a sign of conquering a nation to erect a mosque on sacred ground.

    that said the agenda and the war is not what all Muslims are into its just that there is no separating military from religion in there way of life
    2 blocks away, and an important argument that everyone who opposes it should ask themselves is: How far is far enough? If 2 blocks is too close what about 3, 5, 10?

    It's a devil's advocate question, but for those that do oppose it, it's an important question to ask. And to clarify, I DO oppose it, just not to the point that I want the government stepping in.
    Gone but not forgotten: 2004 Tacoma/2006 Fourwheel Camper<br /><br />ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ<br /><br />&quot;Tyrants mistrust the people, hence they deprive them of arms.&quot;<br />- Aristotle (384-322 B.C.)

  4. #4

    Re: Mosque near Ground Zero, what's your take?

    they have every single right to build the mosque there. no question about that. it is the most simple and fundamental foundation of this country.

    HOWEVER, for every survivor, widow(er), orphan, etc. it is a huge slap in the face. you cant help but think that the location was chosen for a reason, as a giant middle finger to america.

    i will not even attempt to make a generalization about the religion and its people, because you cant. each individual feels a different way, and im sure you could categorize it one way or another, but it just doesnt make sense to. i think it is true the vast majority of muslims in the country, and maybe the world are not against america. but some are, and in this case, i cant help but think these developers and leaders are in the latter category.

    if they want to really build it there, go ahead. but dont complain when you have your place of worship vandalized every night. hate crimes go both ways, and as i see it, the attack was a hate crime, building a mosque there is a hate crime (or at the very least, radically insensitive), so hate crimes will happen back to you. and in no way is this right, but it will happen, so be prepared for it.

    i suppose the city counsel could step in and make the surrounding areas off limits to any new religious buildings, but that would be on shaky legal ground. might stall them for a few years in the courts though.
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  5. #5

    Re: Mosque near Ground Zero, what's your take?

    I could not have said it much better Sean. You're right, they do have every right to build it there, but I wish they wouldn't and I think its a purposeful fark you to America, and at the very least horribly insensitive.
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  6. #6

    Re: Mosque near Ground Zero, what's your take?

    what it really ends up doing is hurting their credibility with the american people. so far, some muslims have flow planes into our buildings, and killed alot of our soldiers (actually thats partially our fault, but thats a different story for a different day). many people in this country have a very difficult relationship with the Muslim world for many reasons, but the two i just mentioned are high up there, if not the top.

    so, you would think, in order to improve relations, the Muslim leadership behind this mosque would have said "oh, you know, i think its too soon. we will build somewhere else, that was insensitive of us, how about at this building, we put a community center or office building and dedicate it to the fallen soldiers or firefighters or children who lost parents, etc" after the first person mentioned that there may possibly be some controversy over this. but no. they push their bullshit on us, and in the end, they look like complete fools and in the eyes of some, terrorists themselves.

    i say go ahead and let them build, on the condition that they dont come crying to us when it all goes horribly wrong.
    2005 Lexus LX470 - Stock for now...

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  7. #7

    Re: Mosque near Ground Zero, what's your take?

    Sean took the words out of my mouth.

    Though, I've read that the people trying to build are severly underfunded.

    99 Taco 2.7/ It&#39;s got stuff<br /><br />[quote author=troyboy162 link=topic=8256.msg78136#msg78136 date=1255335181]Toyota never built a rock brawlin/pimp mobile...you have strayed from the intended use&nbsp; <br />[/quote]

  8. #8

    Re: Mosque near Ground Zero, what's your take?

    I agree with you all. They have a right to build the mosque near ground zero, but out of respect to those who died, they should move it somewhere else. Letting them build the mosque on ground zero is like letting them plant a victory flag, and I personally think that is their goal.

    Now, I do have a problem with this mosque being erected under the leadership of this particular Imam. Some of his rhetoric suggests he is sympathetic to terrorism (such as his refusal to acknowledge Hamas as a terrorist organization). I also have a hard time believing our tax dollars founded his last trip to the middle east.

    Quote Originally Posted by troyboy162
    where exactly is it being built? some things ive read say within inches of ground zero. others say its blocks away.
    From what I understand, it's close enough that the landing gear from one of the planes came through the roof of the building.
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  9. #9

    Re: Mosque near Ground Zero, what's your take?

    Quote Originally Posted by Seanz0rz
    what it really ends up doing is hurting their credibility with the american people. so far, some muslims have flow planes into our buildings, and killed alot of our soldiers (actually thats partially our fault, but thats a different story for a different day). many people in this country have a very difficult relationship with the Muslim world for many reasons, but the two i just mentioned are high up there, if not the top.

    so, you would think, in order to improve relations, the Muslim leadership behind this mosque would have said "oh, you know, i think its too soon. we will build somewhere else, that was insensitive of us, how about at this building, we put a community center or office building and dedicate it to the fallen soldiers or firefighters or children who lost parents, etc" after the first person mentioned that there may possibly be some controversy over this. but no. they push their bullshit on us, and in the end, they look like complete fools and in the eyes of some, terrorists themselves.

    i say go ahead and let them build, on the condition that they dont come crying to us when it all goes horribly wrong.
    Spot on!

    If they are building this knowing the issues this would bring up, it&#39;s not hard to say that they are intentionally creating a larger rift in our society, and between religions, for a reason.

    One can disagree with the people protesting the mosque all they want and tout the 1st amendment (which I agree with 10000%), but sometimes, while you have &#39;the right&#39; to do something, it doesn&#39;t make it wise. Again, not saying that the government should step in, but in cases such as this, it&#39;s not whether they have a right, but it is "why?"

    Let me give you an example:

    Washington state allows for open carry of firearms: http://www.opencarry.org/wa.html

    I work in downtown Seattle. Now, let us say that I follow every law and legally open carry a firearm, through downtown Seattle. What do you think is going to happen? I have the law 100% on my side (on papers, I doubt the police would be on my side...) so everyone should just sit back and accept it, right? Well, not quite, everyone is allowed to have, and voice, their own opinion. Part of the reaction would come from ignorance to firearms and the law (no surprise here in lemming land), but do you think that everyone would be touting my constitutional rights? Nope.

    Openly carrying a firearm, through downtown Seattle, while legal, would be a very stupid idea because:

    1. It would draw an enormous amount of attention, mostly negative, to me.
    2. It would cast a negative light on people who not only openly carry, but all gun owners.
    3. It would create a stereotype that all gun owners are &#39;crazy&#39; or &#39;irresponsible&#39;

    I could elaborate on this a lot more, but I think everyone can understand what I&#39;m saying.
    Gone but not forgotten: 2004 Tacoma/2006 Fourwheel Camper<br /><br />ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ<br /><br />&quot;Tyrants mistrust the people, hence they deprive them of arms.&quot;<br />- Aristotle (384-322 B.C.)

  10. #10

    Re: Mosque near Ground Zero, what's your take?

    exactly!

    i feel the same way about the protesters at the military funerals. is it their 1st amendment right? of course it is! but it is incredibly stupid and insensitive, and just "wrong". but they do have the right, and these soldiers died defending that right, kind of ironic... go protest the war, its good for the country, but dont do it at a funeral!
    2005 Lexus LX470 - Stock for now...

    1998 Toyota 4Runner SR5 V6 4x4 + a bunch of goodies. Lifted, Locked, Illuminated and Armored. Winner,"Best Offroad Truck" - 2010 Pismo Jamboree. It's been upside down and still drives me to work.

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